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Re: Professional or Not (was Database Design)

From: Daniel Morgan <damorgan_at_x.washington.edu>
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 17:14:33 -0800
Message-ID: <1073610793.898250@yasure>


Comments in-line.

Frank van Bortel wrote:

> J Alex wrote:
> 

>> <sybrandb_at_yahoo.com> wrote
>>
>>> "J Alex" <nospam_at_nospam.net> wrote
>>>
>>>> My 2 cents - college degrees matter in IT, just like they do in every
>>
>>
>> other
>>
>>>> professional field. The problem-hires I've seen have been when
>>>> companies
>>>> hire people without degrees, or with degrees in unrelated fields. As
>>>> the
>>>> field matures and companies start requiring comp. sci. degrees, the
>>
>>
>> problem
>>
>>>> of unqualified people will disappear.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It is just nonsense you need a comp.sci degree to be successful in IT.
>>
>>
>>
>> I never said that.
>>
>>
>>> Comp.sci has very little to do with practical IT.
>>
>>
>>
>> Depends on the program I guess, but I learned lots of practical IT,
>> especially development methods and good practices. I'd say the classes
>> were
>> a 50-50 mix of programming classes and theory.
>>
>>
>>> People with a
>>> comp.sci degree aren't necessarily better developers or administrators
>>> compare to people without such a degree.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sure they do. Some people without the degrees are very good, but
>> invariably
>> the developers/dbas that have been least effective have not had an
>> IT-related degree. Why do you think IT is so different than say,
>> chemistry
>> or geology?
>>
> Right - thank you. I'm from the era comp.sci education had to be 
> invented. By your default, I would be less effective than you.
> Funny how many companies ask for me by name, then.
> Oh - I see; I'm one the the exceptions?!?

You might be. That you are an exception does not invalidate the concept. No doubt there are people that could practice medicine that haven't graduated from a medical school. Would you want one performing a triple bypass on you?

> Hmmm - I do see a lot from Daniel Morgan. And with his background (he's 
> in the teaching business) I see another point why he would defend 
> regulation and advertise more education (if that is the right way to put 
> it; I don't mean advertise in any commercial way).

Actually I don't think you see. My program at the University of Washington accepts a maximum of 60 students per year. Above that we turn people away ... each and every year. We also don't accept anyone with less than a BA or BS degree without a waiver from the instructor based on proof of proficiency. The demand for education could go up 500% and I'd not gain $1.00 so I have no vested self-interest.

BTW: The vast majority of my income is from DBA and development work ... not teaching. The fact that I don't promote it here is out of respect for the group (I try not to spam). Nothing more. So if the rules were to change and my ability to work as a developer or DBA required me to become certified ... I'd be in the same boat as everyone else.

-- 
Daniel Morgan
http://www.outreach.washington.edu/ext/certificates/oad/oad_crs.asp
http://www.outreach.washington.edu/ext/certificates/aoa/aoa_crs.asp
damorgan_at_x.washington.edu
(replace 'x' with a 'u' to reply)
Received on Thu Jan 08 2004 - 19:14:33 CST

Original text of this message

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