Re: the usual rubbish from Oracle marketing...

On Sep 10, 9:27 am, DA Morgan <damor..._at_psoug.org> wrote:
> Noons wrote:
> > On Sep 8, 8:30 am, joel garry <joel-ga..._at_home.com> wrote:
>
> >> Funnily enough, the faq says only non-employees can be an ACE,
>
> > Hehehe! Everytime they try to fix it, they
> > stuff up something else.
> > That one is yet another clear inconsistency
> > in a sadly long string. Obviously, no one is even
> > trying to proof-read what is being plastered on
> > that site.
> > How "web 2" is that?...

I'm soooo glad I read that line _before_ taking a sip of the cofee.

>
> And it matters in what significant way?

There are discussions elsewhere in the blogosphere about this, which I've mostly kept out of. Entertaining in a train-wreck sort of way.

>
> Whether Tom Kyte or Ted Farrell are Aces matters in what way to whom?
> If this is important enough for you to generate angst I've no doubt
> you've been traumatized by Paris Hilton and Brittany Spears.

Yeah, those Carl's ads had me wondering what's in the secret sauce. But the Flat Buns ads they're running now are so funny I've gotten over it.

Well, obviously the FAQ and the system are in transition, but it is a legitimate question as to whether it matters. If they've changed the rules so Oracle employees have to give up the designation and it's just a goof that they are in the list, giving up the designation may be a good thing - it addresses a little bit the conflict-of-interest problem, at least for those who aren't totally cynical. But would they get it back when they left Oracle? :-)

(And what a way to find out you've been pink-slipped :-O )

>
> >>> If only we were getting support from oracle up to the level that the
> >>> marketing hype is being driven out at.
> >> The recent calls I've made to support have me quite happy.
>
> > Same here. Support is not the problem. The problem
> > is that the bugs they deal with are not acted upon or given
> > only very low priority against the "new" stuff.
>
> > Meanwhile, those of us who perform the real advocacy
> > by trying to make the blessed thing work at the coalface
> > and get customers to not eject it for its buggy content,
> > for decades on end, get labeled as "cynical".
>
> I didn't realize you were the "real advocacy" for Oracle. Must have
> missed something somewhere. <g> Amazon.com and eBay seem to be using
> the product Ok. So is AT&T, Boeing, every major bank in the world,
> almost every Fortune 500 company, etc. If they can live with it what
> envelope pushing is going on in Oz that justifies this level of
> complaining.

I think specific constructive criticism of the product _is_ advocacy. I can certainly see the cynics point of the love-fest that is 11g being fluff, I feel that way myself. I'm just not as cynical as Noons, I think user groups and other vendor-supported advocacy is a good thing as long as everything is above-board. There's a place for criticism too, and I think cdos is it :-) (not to mention Noon's blog, as well as some others).

>
> >> I tend to emit rude sounds in the direction of marketing!
>
> I do too. And if you'd do it toward marketing rather than development
> I'd join in the chorus.

So you are saying the ACE program is distinct from marketing? I don't see that.

>
> > That's one way of dealing with it. :-)
> > The other of course is to belt them on the head
> > at every opportunity...
>
> And so far the results demonstrate you're successful?

Noons isn't a lone voice in the wilderness by any means.

>
> You know how to contact Mark Townsend directly. If there are specific
> issues raise them with him.

And he's a heckuva guy!

jg

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