Re: Oracle Right or Wrong

bdtmike_at_sbcglobal.net (Mike Dwyer) wrote in message news:<3da33803.172663517_at_news.sf.sbcglobal.net>...
> Over the past several months, I've been learning the in's and out's of
> Oracle programming so that I could port my application over from SQL
> Server. I have received a great deal of help from people in the know,
> and in large part, from these Oracle forums. I find the UseNet to be
> invaluable for getting near-instantaneous feedback from people who are
> out in the real world experiencing the same things that I am.
> Although I've been developing in many languages over the past 20
> years, I'm a newbie to Oracle. As such, I appreciate the constructive
> advice that many of you have given me even though my basic questions
> may have been answered many times over. So, I thank you for all the
> free advice I've been "taking" from this forum.

I think this works much better than some forums that make you contribute before you get anything.  

>
> That said, I've been active in a number of forums in my years but I've
> never seen the level of arrogance and closed mindedness that I see
> from some members of this forum. This posting isn't directed towards
> the people who put forward constructive advice and criticism. This is
> directed towards the people who seem to worship the Oracle God and
> spend as much time pontificating as they do giving advice (if any).

Don't know what forums you've been in, but you should've crossposted this to some unix and ms forums to see some real rudity.   

>
> Is it just me? I can't believe that I'm alone in this observation.
> If any of you share my opinion, by all means, chime in here. Some of
> you guys sound like stiff college professors, scolding me for not
> bringing my "books" to class or disagreeing that Oracle is not the
> end-all of DBMS's. I read the postings. When people ask questions,

Remember, usenet as a commercial venture has not been around as long as the edu usage. Some are indeed college professors and students, and sometimes the "we won't do your homework for you" is actually a correct response. Other times some old bald fat guy is going "huh?" but of course, he should be learning how to post.

> they don't always get answers, they get lectures-- and condescending
> critiques, at that. I run a business, I have questions, I need
> answers. Those of you are nice enough to take the time out to help
> me, I thank you. But those who want to lecture and pontificate should
> save it. Hey, if I wanted a lecture, I'd go back to college! Some of
> you guys really need to lighten up.

I think lecturing and pontificating is useful. If someone is rudely taking a newbie to task, other groupies should respond to that with flamage. As the fellow said about sending a camera to Planet X, "It's all entertainment."

The self-correcting ideal of usenet groupthink is flawed, but it does work sometimes.

>
> As a user trying to understand a new product, I like to read the
> members' opinions to find out what the strengths and weaknesses of
> the product are in relation to others in its class. Unfortunately,
> the discussions are rather one-sided in this forum. And from what
> I've seen, people are probably afraid to use the "M" word in here for
> fear they will be flamed and moofed to death (as I will certainly be).
> Some of you guys sound like "Little Larry Ellisons" running around
> with noses in the air phrasing every answer to every question with
> "And that's another reason why Oracle is great and Microsoft sucks.".
> A little objectivity please...

You can always crosstrollpost and filter.

>
> In the interest of debate, can you honestly say that NOTHING that SQL
> server has to offer is better than what Oracle puts out? Or that
> there is NO feature that some other DBMS may have that is superior to
> Oracle? Or that Oracle may have limitations that other products do
> not? If your answer is a resounding "NO" then I think that some of
> you need to open your minds a bit.

I think it is very difficult to justify O over MS for a small stand-alnone system. The demarcation of justification could be a very interesting
thread.

Ten years ago, I used 10-15 users as a rough rule of thumb. Now I use 60-150 users. Unless there is some overiding business issue like the law says you have to use Oracle.

Note that I have hardly worked on any non-Oracle for a number of years now. But I have worked on plenty of things that suffer from being able
to run on different dbms.

>
> To some of you I'm sure I'm sounding like a jerk here. But to others

You sound plenty diplomatic to me.

> in the group, I believe that you know what I'm talking about when it
> comes to the "attitude" in here. In my 3 month long "Trial By Fire",
> I've come to the conclusion that Oracle is, overall, the most powerful
> DBMS out there. But there are areas where Oracle lags behind
> Microsoft and there is room for improvement. I feel like a PC user in
> a Mac group for saying this, but I'd like to see a little more
> objectivity and discussion about the pros and cons in here, that's
> all. God forbid, someone like me admits that in here, but hey, what
> do I know, I'm just a newbie, right <g>?

Yes, you are. You should have posted this in cdo.misc, not cdo.server. :-)

There have been plenty of reasoned arguments and unreasoned flamage on the O vs non-O merits, and I think there is plenty of room for more.

jg

--
@home is bogus.
"As we celebrate mediocrity / All the boys upstairs want to see / How
much you'll pay for what you used to get for free. "- Tom Petty