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Re: (Fwd)

From: James J. Morrow <>
Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:10:26 -0800
Message-ID: <>

"Eric D. Pierce" wrote:
> trying again...
> ------- Forwarded message follows -------
> Responsibility / Re: OT -unix
> Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 18:55:37 -0400
> Connect the dots, contrary to the highly postured false
> rectitude that you
> are conveying, Ellison has a very long track record of sleaze
> that at a
> minimum, ought to elicite a great deal of suspicion.

I won't debate Larry's personality. I've heard numerous rumors and accusations of "sleaze" (and skirt-chasing, etc.) and, since I've never met the man, I feel wholly unqualified to comment on his personal behavior. From what I've seen of him in the media, I'll definitely state that he is NOT suffering from any sort of inferiority complex at the very least. That said, few individuals at the helm of any major company can be described as "completely humble". (I tend to believe that a healthy ego may be required to succeed in the company-founder/CEO realm).

> (I will contact McCain's people for additional info, let me
> know if you
> would like me to mention you personally :)
> Assuming that you actually care about corporate
> responsibility, and aren't
> just acting pissy for the heck of it, you can find additional
> background on
> McCain's position here:
> Most recently, Oracle tried to buy off legislators to thwart
> an audit of
> the ELA that Oracle/Logicon put together with the State of
> California. As
> far as I'm concerned, all the *ssholes involved in that at
> Oracle/Logicon,
> lobbyists, and in the legislature, ought to be in jail.

My understanding from various news stories (I could probably dig up links if anyone wants), is that the basic deal with the State of California was a (relatively) typical bundle-deal. Someone determined what California's needs were (probably incorrectly) and sold them a fairly all-encompasing license. Were the salesmen [from what I understand, they were *not* Oracle employees, but were partners] too aggressive? Probably. (Even Oracle's salesforce has been known to be overly aggressive in the past... no really!]

As to the "buying off the legislators", the article I read simply stated that an email existed from the Oracle Lobbyist to the people at corporate suggested that "spreading some money around" might make the problem go away. The mere fact that the lobbyist suggested that goes to the sleaze of the lobbyist and the inherenet sleze in dealing with politicians in general. My understanding is that Oracle Corp. did *not* make the recommended "contributions".

> btw, I'm sure that if Ellison had sold lots of stock at the
> bottom of the
> market, and then it went way up, no one would complain.

As for Larry selling stock, my understanding is that ORCL has *not* been "tanked" by any company-specific news (relative to this stock sale). So, maybe Larry just got lucky. Maybe Larry was able to "read" the market and made an educated decision to sell. It's only illegal if you use priviledged (non-public) information to time a trade. (e.g. if Larry sold the stock the day/week before announcing bad numbers, etc.)

Consider reading: (A collection of articles on the CA/ORCL problem)

As to the John McCain position on Larry Ellison/Oracle, a search on the for "oracle" or "Ellison" yields nothing. Now, admittedly, I didn't read Mr. McCain's entire site. And, I will say, that, as congress-critters go, Mr. John McCain seems to be a pretty decent guy. So, (Eric), if you have a more specific link, I'd love to see it.

Looking at: at the "Insider Trades" on ORCL


2001-01-30  ELLISON,LAWRENCE J.(RT12/95) Chief Executive Officer 5,000,000
Planned Sale (Estimated proceeds of $152,742,000) 

2001-01-29  ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 5,000,000 Planned Sale
(Estimated proceeds of $151,991,265) 

2001-01-26  ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 2,232,000 Planned Sale
(Estimated proceeds of $67,797,000) 

2001-01-25  ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 5,000,000 Planned Sale
(Estimated proceeds of $149,685,000) 

2001-01-24  ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 5,000,000 Planned Sale
(Estimated proceeds of $150,310,000) 
2001-01-23  ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 5,000,000 Planned Sale
(Estimated proceeds of $157,420,000) 
2001-01-22  ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 5,000,000 Planned Sale
(Estimated proceeds of $159,060,000) 

2001-01-22 - 2001-01-31 ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 29,084,576
Sale at $30.034 - $32.008 per share.  (Proceeds of about $902,233,000) 

2001-01-22 - 2001-01-29 ELLISON, LAWRENCE J. Chief Executive Officer 22,232,000
Option Exercise at $0.225 per share. 

Looking at the Graph for ORCL:

Seems to show ORCL mostly following NASDAQ.

(sorry about the ugly URL)

> regards,
> ep
> | Original Message:
> | -----------------
> | From: Tim Gorman Tim_at_SageLogix=2Ecom
> | Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 13:02:06 -0800
> | To: ORACLE-L_at_fatcity=2Ecom
> | Subject: Re: McCain on Larry Ellison and Corporate
> Responsibility /=20
> | Re: OT - unix
> |
> | Nope=2E
> |
> | I just thought that people are innocent until proven
> guilty=2E One=20
> | thing about someone in Ellison's position is that it would
> be=20
> | impossible for him to *ever* sell stock without having the
> unfounded
> | accusations you've quoted being hurled at him=2E So, are
> you saying=20
> | that it is OK to throw such accusations around, when you
> don't know
> | anything about anything? Or is there further substantiation
> for what
> | you're saying? Does that mean he should never sell stock?
> Or should
> | he just live his life and ignore the critics?
> |
> | I respect and admire Sen=2E McCain as much as I respect and
> admire=20
> | anyone, but he is not infallible and he (and his staff) can
> certainly
> | be off the mark=2E=2E=2E
> ----- Original Message -----
> To: "Tim Gorman" <Tim_at_SageLogix=2Ecom>; <ORACLE-
> L_at_fatcity=2Ecom>
> Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 10:49 AM
> unix
> > Tim,
> >
> > It is my understanding that Oracle's stocks have gone
> > up and down wildly several times=2E
> >
> > As you say, the only time I've heard that Larry
> > Ellison cashed out before a plunge happened was the
> > recent one that McCain brought up=2E
> >
> > I'm afraid I fail to see what you think people should
> > conclude from all that=2E
> >
> > Are you saying that it is ok for stock holding workers
> > and investors to get gigantically screwed just because
> > Larry Ellison has only done it once?
<SNIP> -- James ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- James J. Morrow E-Mail: Senior Principal Consultant Tenure Systems, Inc. McKinney, TX, USA "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: -- Author: James J. Morrow INET: Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Received on Thu Jul 18 2002 - 15:10:26 CDT

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