Return-Path: Received: from ensim.rackshack.net (root@localhost) by orafaq.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9T9F4d13233 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 03:15:04 -0600 X-ClientAddr: 209.68.248.164 Received: from newsfeed.cts.com (newsfeed.cts.com [209.68.248.164]) by ensim.rackshack.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9T9F4R13227 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 03:15:04 -0600 Received: from fatcity.UUCP (uucp@localhost) by newsfeed.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with UUCP id WAA34393; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:56:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by fatcity.com (26-Feb-2001/v1.0g-b72/bab) via UUCP id 004F5CF3; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:08:27 -0800 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:08:27 -0800 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L X-Comment: Oracle RDBMS Community Forum X-Sender: "Tom Pall" Sender: root@fatcity.com Reply-To: ORACLE-L@fatcity.com Errors-To: ML-ERRORS@fatcity.com From: "Tom Pall" Subject: Re: Oracle Internals course Organization: Fat City Network Services, San Diego, California X-ListServer: v1.0g, build 72; ListGuru (c) 1996-2001 Bruce A. Bergman Precedence: bulk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_028C_01C27EDF.07F504A0" ------=_NextPart_000_028C_01C27EDF.07F504A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: Oracle Internals courseMeaning you're not planning on letting your = DBA go because Oracle now has now no initialization parameters to tweak = (Wrong!), is self configuring, self maintaining, self tuning, self = repairing? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Khedr, Waleed=20 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L=20 Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 6:58 PM Subject: RE: Oracle Internals course I think the external visible Oracle stuff are enough to keep any DBA = busy these days:) -----Original Message----- From: Tom Pall [mailto:tpall@realtime.net] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 5:24 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: Re: Oracle Internals course That rumor's been going on for versions now. As has been Scott's = desire to offer a two week internals course. Course participants would = sign all sorts of non-disclosure forms then get a scaled down version of = what's taught to Customer Support. Wait a minute! Customer Support takes = these courses? Surely not all the Silver Support people I've called. A = difficulty with a two week course is that the very DBAs most likely to = benefit from the course are the ones least likely to be let free for two = weeks. The internals course is slated to be yanked every time a new version = of Oracle comes out. Why teach internals when there are no = initialization parameters and the database maintains and tunes itself? = There's been an economic downturn and Oracle DBAs have lost their jobs. = But anybody know an Oracle DBA who lost his job because a later version = doesn't require a DBA? Oracle on CDs 1,2 and 3, huh? I think if I dig = enough I can find that old version of Oracle I had that came on a single = diskette. Scott says the internals course is purposely hidden. You have to = call Oracle directly and ask for it. A number of people registered for = the course from the paper or online catalogs, showed up then complained = that they weren't about to get anything out of the course.. =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Nick Wagner=20 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L=20 Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 3:23 PM Subject: RE: Oracle Internals course rumor has it that this course is not going to be offered/modified = for the 9.2 release of Oracle. Can anyone confirm or deny it? =20 Nick=20 p.s. Had a close friend take this class, and they also came back = extremely pleased with it.=20 -----Original Message-----=20 From: Rachel Carmichael [mailto:wisernet100@yahoo.com]=20 Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 12:19 PM=20 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L=20 Subject: Re: Oracle Internals course=20 Scott is the "instructors's instructor"=20 he learns the new features, then teaches them to the instructors = so=20 they can teach them to you=20 I had the pleasure of taking those classes with Scott a few years = ago=20 as well. He's a great teacher.=20 If he is ever presenting at any conference you go to, GO SEE HIM=20 --- Tom Pall wrote:=20 > I took that very course with Scott a few years ago. Yup, Scott = flies=20 > through the Internals and Dump/Traces courses with lots of extra = > material to=20 > spare. It's really refreshing to hear him tell the class how = the=20 > developers=20 > documented something then tell how it's actually built. He = keeps a=20 > database=20 > running in his notebook to prove what he says. Scott's one = great=20 > teacher.=20 > ----- Original Message -----=20 > To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" = =20 > Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 12:53 PM=20 >=20 >=20 > I just wanted to say...=20 >=20 > If you have a chance to take the Oracle Internals course with = Scott=20 > Gossett=20 > at Oracle, I highly recommend it.=20 >=20 > I wish I knew half of what he knows!=20 >=20 > The course isn't included in the OCP tracks, I think it should = be=20 > given a=20 > higher profile though.=20 >=20 > Regards,=20 > Patrice Boivin=20 > Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)=20 >=20 > Systems Admin & Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des syst=E8mes=20 > Technology Services | Services technologiques=20 > Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique=20 > Maritimes Region, DFO | R=E9gion des Maritimes, MPO=20 >=20 > E-Mail: boivinp@mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca=20 >=20 >=20 > --=20 > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com=20 > --=20 > Author: Boivin, Patrice J=20 > INET: BoivinP@mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca=20 >=20 > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 = http://www.fatcity.com=20 > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting = services=20 > = ---------------------------------------------------------------------=20 > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail = message=20 > to: ListGuru@fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and = in=20 > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L=20 > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You = may=20 > also send the HELP command for other information (like = subscribing).=20 >=20 > --=20 > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com=20 > --=20 > Author: Tom Pall=20 > INET: tpall@realtime.net=20 >=20 > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 = http://www.fatcity.com=20 > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting = services=20 > = ---------------------------------------------------------------------=20 > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail = message=20 > to: ListGuru@fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and = in=20 > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L=20 > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You = may=20 > also send the HELP command for other information (like = subscribing).=20 __________________________________________________=20 Do you Yahoo!?=20 Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site=20 http://webhosting.yahoo.com/=20 --=20 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com=20 --=20 Author: Rachel Carmichael=20 INET: wisernet100@yahoo.com=20 Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 = http://www.fatcity.com=20 San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting = services=20 = ---------------------------------------------------------------------=20 To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message=20 to: ListGuru@fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and = in=20 the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L=20 (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You = may=20 also send the HELP command for other information (like = subscribing).=20 ------=_NextPart_000_028C_01C27EDF.07F504A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: Oracle Internals course
Meaning you're not planning on letting = your DBA go=20 because Oracle now has now no initialization parameters to tweak = (Wrong!), is=20 self configuring, self maintaining, self tuning, self = repairing?
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Khedr,=20 Waleed
Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 = 6:58=20 PM
Subject: RE: Oracle Internals=20 course

I=20 think the external visible Oracle stuff are enough to keep any DBA = busy these=20 days:)
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Pall=20 [mailto:tpall@realtime.net]
Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 = 5:24=20 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list = ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:=20 Oracle Internals course

That rumor's been going on for = versions=20 now.  As has been Scott's desire to offer a two week internals=20 course.  Course participants would sign all sorts of = non-disclosure=20 forms then get a scaled down version of what's taught to Customer = Support.=20 Wait a minute! Customer Support takes these courses?  Surely=20 not all the Silver Support people I've called.  A = difficulty with=20 a two week course is that the very DBAs most likely to benefit from = the=20 course are the ones least likely to be let free for two = weeks.
 
The internals course is slated to = be yanked=20 every time a new version of Oracle comes out.  Why teach = internals when=20 there are no initialization parameters and the database maintains = and tunes=20 itself?  There's been an economic downturn and Oracle DBAs have = lost=20 their jobs.  But anybody know an Oracle DBA who lost his job = because a=20 later version doesn't require a DBA?  Oracle on CDs 1,2 and 3,=20 huh?  I think if I dig enough I can find that old version of = Oracle I=20 had that came on a single diskette.
 
Scott says the internals course is = purposely=20 hidden.  You have to call Oracle directly and ask for it.  = A=20 number of people registered for the course from the paper or online=20 catalogs, showed up then complained that they weren't about to get = anything=20 out of the course.. 
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Nick=20 Wagner
Sent: Monday, October 28, = 2002 3:23=20 PM
Subject: RE: Oracle = Internals=20 course

rumor has it that this course is not going to be = offered/modified for the 9.2 release of Oracle.  Can anyone = confirm=20 or deny it?  

Nick

p.s. Had a close friend take this class, and = they also=20 came back extremely pleased with it.

-----Original Message-----
From:=20 Rachel Carmichael [mailto:wisernet100@yahoo.com]=20
Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 12:19 PM =
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re: Oracle Internals course


Scott is the "instructors's instructor" =

he learns the new features, then teaches them to = the=20 instructors so
they can teach them to = you=20

I had the pleasure of taking those classes with = Scott a=20 few years ago
as well. He's a great=20 teacher.

If he is ever presenting at any conference you = go to, GO=20 SEE HIM

--- Tom Pall <tpall@realtime.net> = wrote:=20
> I took that very course with Scott a few = years=20 ago.  Yup, Scott flies
> through = the=20 Internals and Dump/Traces courses with lots of extra =
> material to
> = spare.  It's=20 really refreshing to hear him tell the class how the =
> developers
> documented = something=20 then tell how it's actually built.  He keeps a =
> database
> running in = his notebook=20 to prove what he says.  Scott's one great
> teacher.
> ----- = Original Message=20 -----
> To: "Multiple recipients of = list=20 ORACLE-L" <ORACLE-L@fatcity.com>
> Sent:=20 Monday, October 28, 2002 12:53 PM
>=20
>
> I = just wanted to=20 say...
>
> If you=20 have a chance to take the Oracle Internals course with = Scott=20
> Gossett
> at = Oracle, I=20 highly recommend it.
> =
> I wish I knew half of what he knows! =
>
> The course isn't = included in the=20 OCP tracks, I think it should be
> = given=20 a
> higher profile though. =
>
> Regards, =
> Patrice Boivin
> = Systems Analyst=20 (Oracle Certified DBA)
> =
> Systems Admin & Operations | Admin. et Exploit. = des=20 syst=E8mes
> Technology=20 Services        | Services=20 technologiques
> Informatics=20 Branch         | Direction = de=20 l'informatique
> Maritimes Region,=20 DFO      | R=E9gion des Maritimes, = MPO=20
>
> E-Mail:=20 boivinp@mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca
> =
>
> --
>=20 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>=20 --
> Author: Boivin, Patrice J =
>   INET: BoivinP@mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca =
>
> Fat City Network=20 Services    -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San=20 Diego, California        -- = Mailing=20 list and web hosting services
>=20 = ---------------------------------------------------------------------=20
> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, = send an=20 E-Mail message
> to: = ListGuru@fatcity.com (note=20 EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> the=20 message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L =
> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed=20 from).  You may
> also send the = HELP=20 command for other information (like subscribing).
>
> --
>=20 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> --=20
> Author: Tom Pall
>   INET: tpall@realtime.net =
>
> Fat City Network=20 Services    -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San=20 Diego, California        -- = Mailing=20 list and web hosting services
>=20 = ---------------------------------------------------------------------=20
> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, = send an=20 E-Mail message
> to: = ListGuru@fatcity.com (note=20 EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> the=20 message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L =
> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed=20 from).  You may
> also send the = HELP=20 command for other information (like subscribing).


__________________________________________________=20
Do you Yahoo!?
Y! Web = Hosting -=20 Let the expert host your web site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com/
--=20
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--=20
Author: Rachel Carmichael =
  INET: wisernet100@yahoo.com

Fat City Network Services    --=20 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
San=20 Diego, California        -- = Mailing=20 list and web hosting services
----------------------------------------------------------------= -----=20
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send = an E-Mail=20 message
to: ListGuru@fatcity.com (note = EXACT=20 spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
the = message BODY,=20 include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
(or the=20 name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You = may=20
also send the HELP command for other = information (like=20 subscribing). =

------=_NextPart_000_028C_01C27EDF.07F504A0-- -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Tom Pall INET: tpall@realtime.net Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services --------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: ListGuru@fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).