Re: Pre-relational, post-relational, 1968 CODASYL "Survey of Data Base Systems"

From: Anne & Lynn Wheeler <>
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 14:38:57 -0600
Message-ID: <>

"Laconic2" <> writes:
> Given that MUMPS and UNIX were both originally developed on DEC
> gear, and that DEC-10s were heavily represented in the early
> ARPANET, the influence of DEC on computing is larger than many
> people realize.

part of the issue was that ibm mainline business somewhat walked away from the educational & interactive market ... cutting way back on their traditional deep educational discounts as well as adopting a very strong commercial batch orientation. during the later half of the 60s and the 70s it was a very succesful business approach.

some past posts mentioning not winning project mac & belllabs in the 60s (specific mention in the 2nd to last paragraph in the this post): 40yrs, science center, feb. 1964

the science center:

did build a virtual memory, interactive oriented system that did see quite a bit of success, even at some number of universities and had some arpanet nodes. however, it was also used extensively inside the corporation (as well at large number of corporations).

the internal network ... also done at the cambridge science center was larger than the arpanet/internet thruout most of its lifetime until sometime mid-85. This was in part because the arpanet was a relatively traditional homogeneous network concept (although packet based rather than circuit base). It wasn't until the great switchover of 1/1/83, that the apranet/internet got internetworking protocol and gateways. By contrast, the internal network basically had gateway-like function built into every node. As a result, the internal network was much more a internetworking implementation all thru the 70s (which simplified the task of adding additonal nodes). somewhat related posting on the subject:

reference to the 1000th node on the internal network the summer of 83: not long after the arpanet conversion to internetworking protocol and enabling to go past 255 nodes (i.e. at the time the arpanet reached 255 nodes, the internal network was around 800 nodes).

the other thing that enabled the internet to exceed the number of nodes on the internal network by the summer of '85 was the prolification of workstations and PCs as network nodes (while the internal network continued as predomitly mainframes).

To slightly bring it back on topic, this platform developed at the science center in addition to providing the basis for most of the internal corporate business and network platforms (as well as a fairly succesful product offering to customers) ... it was also the platform used at SJR to develop the original relational database and SQL. misc posts on the subject: ... and eventually as a product offering with system/r tech transfer from SJR to Endicott for SQL/DS. there was then tech transfer from Endicott back to STL for what became DB2 (note that SJR and STL were only something like ten miles apart).

SJR was in bldg. 28 on the main plant site ... now Hitachi. However, in the mid-80s, research had already moved up the hill and is now referred to as ARC.

STL was originally going to be called the Coyote Lab .... following some convention of naming after the nearest post office. However, the week before STL opening ceremonies, there was a group of ladies (from san francisco) that demonstrated on the steps of congress. This prompted changing the labs name.

Anne & Lynn Wheeler |
Received on Tue Apr 27 2004 - 22:38:57 CEST

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