Path: newssvr20.news.prodigy.com!newsmst01.news.prodigy.com!prodigy.com!prodigy.com!rip!news.webusenet.com!feed3.newsreader.com!newsreader.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!firehose2!nntp4!intern1.nntp.aus1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!nntp.golden.net!news.golden.net.POSTED!not-for-mail NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 03:05:16 -0600 From: "Bob Badour" Newsgroups: comp.databases.theory References: Subject: Re: Stored fields ordered left to right Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 04:04:56 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Lines: 29 NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.35.144.163 X-Trace: sv3-L2h6DW1ui8Jw1vHWvP26uv7K/xuhxs13EEftarN0mHb8vYqvqWcBM/DkWtogfQiQXjBvj5lN/4F/PK+!oB55DOFOGAm/HKuT9hzJJETK1fDGTQPxiUbY0BYJxSTZzvkXJ1srHwuxWtAlbCjNsVaErKEM3Q== X-Complaints-To: abuse@golden.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: abuse@golden.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.1 Xref: newssvr20.news.prodigy.com comp.databases.theory:23113 "Lauri Pietarinen" wrote in message news:e9d83568.0312272356.6b916a15@posting.google.com... > "Dawn M. Wolthuis" wrote in message news:... > > Do you agree, Bob, that relational database theory seems to require > > constructs that are NOT mathematical relations (because they have no logical > > ordering among attributes)? > > > > Do you also agree that some of the data models that are not considered by > > relational theorists to be relational are, in this way, actually MORE > > relational in that they do require logical constructs (ordered tuples) that > > correspond to mathematical relations? > > > > This is one of several issues I'm trying to square away or at least get a > > vocabulary that is not so contradictory. Thanks --dawn Apparently, Dawn does not realise she has been in my twit-filter for months now. For anyone who doesn't know, ignore Dawn--she's an idiot. Mathematical relations do not have any particular attribute order. The physical representation of mathematical relations using written symbols on planar surfaces relies on physical order for succinctness.