Re: choices regarding where to place code - in the database or middletier

[Quoted] <sybrandb_at_yahoo.com> wrote in message news:a1d154f4.0401220423.2c4ea885_at_posting.google.com...
> Joe Weinstein <joeNOSPAM_at_bea.com> wrote in message
news:<400EB04E.1010101_at_bea.com>...
> > Depending on an external layer for what the DBMS is best at, *is*
begging
> > for problems. However, I believe there's a lot that the DBMS can't do
well,
> > and depending on the DBMS to do that stuff is also begging for problems,
in
> > performance to start.
> > To repeat the inarguable example, the DBMS can't even do the basic job
it was
> > designed to do by itself, in a test designed specifically to exercize a
DBMS,
> > as fast by itself, as it can when it uses an intelligent middle tier.
> > We're focussing on our differences, but I am also a DBMS guy, and we
would
> > probably agree for the most part on specific functionality that should
be in
> > the DBMS.
> > Joe Weinstein at BEA
>
> Apparently you have been brainwashed and consider middle-tier to be
> THE Gospel, and now you are trying to brainwash others. Your assertion
> 'depending on the DBMS is begging for problems' demonstrates that
> clearly: you simply don't know what you are talking about. I have seen
> NO (I repeat NO) middle-tier applications that couldn't be qualified
> as a complete DRAMA. Anyone with only a little bit of experience in
> the field is aware of that.
> There is NOTHING in a middle-tier that couldn't be done by a DBMS, in
> most cases having it done by a middle-tier 'application' is at it's
> best asking for something completely unscalable (which BTW everyone
> with a little bit of experience knows).

Drawing graphs, working on OS files, computing complex fourier transforms. I can't see that any of these belong in the DBMS in general. Why would anyone use forms or C or Java to write applications anyway, just use the database. [Quoted] Surely the key is doing the right stuff in the right place. The app server guys have a *lot* of arguing to do with me around the case for database [Quoted] independence and middle tier data validation etc, ISTM that this approach is purely in the interest of app developers, but not in the interest of good design and application owners and users. Equally arguing that the database can and should do everything seems equally mad.

--
Niall Litchfield
[Quoted] Oracle DBA
Audit Commission UK
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