Re: Db crashed with no backups :confused:

From: joel garry <>
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 11:40:27 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <>

On Feb 3, 10:56 am, "SEJ" <> wrote:
> hi
> i cant read them all

And I can't read your formatting. Come on guy, learn to post!

> "ddf" <> skrev i en
> Comments embedded.
> On Feb 1, 12:46 pm, "SEJ" <> wrote:
> > Well must top post
> No, you choose to do so.  And, of course, that IS your choice to make.
> Sybrand dosent like

I've publicly told Sybrand to be more positive. However, I recognize he has his valid reasons, and leave it at that, he can follow my suggestions or not, his choice. Plenty of room in this group for divergent views. Plenty of room on the rest of the intertubes for anyone who wants to leave in a huff.

> > If you havent read the complete documentation like the tora you cant get
> > help from the DBA´s, If you made an errror you will know. This group
> > belong
> > to them and stupid questions like yours are not allowed.
> Certainly they are; this thread exists simply because the question was
> allowed to be posted.

Any question can be posted: some will be flamed. Some shouldn't be posted. There is a charter, and plenty of advice on getting along in this group. I wrote some:

> Have youe read how many questions were the answer is read the documetation ?

Have you thought that might be the correct answer?

> > This group can somtimes be almost like religion,
> Really?  And we thought it good, common sense to follow accepted
> practices.  Silly us.
> You are the real DBA's, you know almost all about Oracle on the backbone why
> scare people away, -perhaps a starting DBA ?

I'm with you on this one, but this group has one big advantage - it is unmoderated. Some places, you can't be a wimp and be a DBA. "You cannot go against nature, go against nature, that's part of nature too." - Love and Rockets

> > and yes they can Oracle to
> > their fingertips,
> What, exactly, does that mean?
> What do you do beside Oracle ?
> AD, Windows IIS, Client system, Project manageing, worst case QA for QA

That's all nice, but does it really qualify you to give advice on how to give DBA advice?

> > so i do not know why they bother comment your question.
> Because it illustrates a valid point of what happens when there are no
> backups taken of a database.  To consider a 'development' database
> 'non-production' is likely wrong, as the development team uses it to
> produce code/applications, thus to them it IS a production database
> and should be worthy of the same attention as the 'actual production
> database' the end-users access.  Shakespeare made this point in an
> earlier response.
> I agree, but it do not help him.

Well, I don't agree with that. There's ONE THING a DBA must get right - recovery. If it takes abuse/firing for people to get that, so be it. You could take the positive view, and realize that people could learn from the advice.

> > Sometimes you can get help from Oracle "wannebees" like my self, I have
> > been
> > working with databases for 25 years only 10 with Oracle but if you do
> > other
> > things, you cant red everything. I have never read any and have always got
> > what i wanted by doing the right search.
> Does that mean you don't read the documents you do look up?
> Yes, I read what others have done in the excact same situation, -no docs, im
> not a DBA.

It's tempting to say "stick to IIS."

> > I have read the comments for some of the persons in this group for many
> > years, and they don not ask questions in other groups. (not in their own
> > name)
> What name do they use?
> I'm sorry
> you have 1720 in google groups
> 36 are in other groups, some to do with oracle

Uh, what?

> > Properly they have not understood the gain of information the internet
> > have
> > brougth to them,
> Why, then, would we promote internet searches for those who visit and
> present often-asked (and more often answered) questions if we don't
> understand the power of the medium?  Your comment makes no sense.
> Why do you bother comment with "read the documentation"
> My real problem is that youre not polite, if we ask stupid questions

That's the thing - stupid questions. I've advocated being nice to newbies, but I can see the other viewpoint. So when does a question become stupid? When it appears the person hasn't put in basic effort to solve it first, especially when the person does that repeatedly. There's a doc about how to ask good questions. There's a metalink doc on how to submit good support requests. Do I need to point to them here?

> > but on the otherhand what is there to know beside Unix and
> > oracle.
> Windows, VMS, Linux, OS/2, OS/400 as Oracle also runs on those
> operating systems. :)
> well i know.
> Small DBA's work on windows, the application i support on Oracle for 80
> customers, 40.000 users OLTP all day, 20 of those of course have their own
> real DBA on UNIX in GRID and so on, the others we have to support if it goes
> wrong. From Oracle 7.3.4 to 10.2.03 wihh 6 major version and 60  minor
> patches and off cource the customers own application, their own backup
> methods and so on, and many more. I do not hve the time to concentrate on
> Oracle, -im sorry.

So again, why does that qualify you to tell others how to give Oracle advice? When I was an application vendor support person, I concentrated on Oracle, that made me very sought after. Years later, I'm still benefitting from that. And still laughing at vendors who don't have a goto Oracle person.

> Our customers are looking for a version for MS sql, - i hope not
> And, in the context of this newsgroup, what other questions are asked
> here?

Where can I go to get organic vaseline for my... oh, never mind.


-- is bogus.
Received on Tue Feb 03 2009 - 13:40:27 CST

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