Re: Oracle 10G Grid Control

On Jul 6, 4:23 pm, Fred Pierce <l..._at_avialantic.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 06 Jul 2007 13:40:16 -0700, DA Morgan <damor..._at_psoug.org>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> >HansF wrote:
> >> On Jul 6, 9:32 am, Fred Pierce <l..._at_avialantic.com> wrote:
> >>> On Thu, 05 Jul 2007 06:49:52 -0700, DA Morgan <damor..._at_psoug.org>
> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>> rajesh_chopr..._at_yahoo.co.uk wrote:
> >>>>> Does anyone know if Grid control is a bundled product with the
> >>>>> enterprise edition of the database or a separate product purchasable?
> >>>>> TIA
> >>>> The Grid is separate and the Diagnostic Pack, Tuning Pack, etc.
> >>>> separate licensing.
> >>> Is it just me or is it getting even harder to find out info like that?
> >>> Once upon a time, I recall, after much digging, being able to find a
> >>> listing of what an Oracle product included and what was optional. Now,
>
> >> You are right.
>
> >> It is pretty difficult to go tohttp://docs.oracle.com, look up the
> >> version of the database, and read the Licensing document.
>
> And how would a customer know this? Why should they have to play
> "guess the url?" That's what links, tabs, and large type is for.
>
> Why should a customer have to dig for basic information to determine
> if they're interested in a product?
>

You do have a point. Oracle should make it easy to get access to all the information on all of their products.

Last time I counted, there were about 300 different products and several versions of each. Each having a unique feature matrix.

People should not have to dig for that stuff.

> >>> Even the online store is well hidden - teeny link in the lower right
> >>> of the main oracle.com page. Then once you get into the store, no link
> >>> back to oracle.com. And still no listing of features - just charge 40k
> >>> to your visa and guess what you bought (would anybody do that? why
> >>> have an online store if they don't?).
>
> >> Yup. Few people would actually typehttp://store.oracle.comor search
> >> for 'purchase' or 'store' in the search boxes on the Oracle pages.
>
> Same thing. How is it in the interest of the vendor to make the
> customer hunt for their store.
>
> >> I totally agree - once in the store, you have to release your mouse
> >> and actually have to type 'www.oracle.com'to get back to the main
> >> Oracle site. Or in the case of Firefox, type 'Oracle' in the URL box
> >> and hit enter to force the system to do Web 2 resolution. Horrible
> >> that they would make us do that. Horrible.
>
> Yep - lots of extra motion and obstacles. Web design 101 - make your
> site navigable.
>
> >> Feature listings in the store? Nope. You are right, they don't
> >> duplicate the 55,000 pages of documentation.
>
> What does that have do do with it? You can list the features and
> options of any Oracle product in a few pages.
>
>
>
> >> I think you should offer your services to Oracle to help them design a
> >> usable web interface.
>
> OK - Oracle: add tabs or more conspicuous links to your store.
> Cut back on the hype and put the essential info - product listings and
> prices - where potential customers can find it.
> Add a "Home" tab or maintain the same nav aids as any decently designe
> web site.

Yup.

Sadly, Oracle has a web design team that changes the entire look and feel every 6 months, whether it is needed or not.

Every 2 or 3 overhauls they come up with a good one. Personally, I do not like the current look and feel. Tics me off that it takes a whole whack of time to get used to the new look and feel to find the information, even old information that I know exists, that I need.

Which is the reason I always answer with the quick, direct access URLs such as http://docs.oracle.com, http://otn.oracle.com, http://store.oracle.com

>
> >Lets get together a collection and send a sympathy card. <g>
>
> I certainly hope neither of you are ever in sales. Your reaction seems
> to be:
>
> Let the customer do all the work. Their time is of no consequence. Our
> product is so good they'll spend as much time as needed to figure it
> out.
>

No. My reaction is simpler than that.

Oracle has such a large suite of products and solutions that an intelligent customer will invoke the sales team, discuss the business problem with a certain amount of honesty, and work WITH the sales team to determine one or more appropriate solutions.

Then , once the customer has reached a certain stage of maturity with the product, they can very quickly navigate the mess that is called http://www.oracle.com to get their information.

Surprising how few customers do it this way. And it's _always_ the vendor's fault when the customer buys the wrong stuff.

> You guys must love phone menus and self-checkouts in grocery stores.
> Must be nice to have nothing to do.

That is why I use the tools that the vendor gives me - sales team, pre sales, etc. - instead of assuming my solution and then finding out, months later that my doofus assumptions wasted both time and money.

It is also the reason why I find most product sales on the internet as simply wrong. Pretty, glitzy, fast, and self-fulfilling ... but wrong.

My job as purchaser simple ... define the business problem. And find the correct resource to solve the problem. Why so many start with the proposed solution is beyond me.

> Come to think of it, I do have things to do. Just find it interesting
> how people do, or don't, do business.

I've been on all sides of the fence - analyst, designer, developer, sales, user, purchaser, consulting, marketing. Now that I am an independent, I make a comfortable living fixing the 'solution' some techno-weenie has recommended. Fortunately most of the time the solution mistakes have nothing to do with Oracle - it's expensive enough that people actually stop to think, or even hire the likes of me to ensure they don't screw up royally. It's the multiple copies of the "only $199/copy" cheap, but useless, software they buy that are a total waste of time.

/Hans Received on Fri Jul 06 2007 - 18:36:39 CDT