Re: Interviewing process (was: Re: moron OEM and RBS)

From: DA Morgan <damorgan_at_exesolutions.com>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:22:45 -0800
Message-ID: <3E0351E5.35FE6A34@exesolutions.com>

Joel Garry wrote:

> DA Morgan <damorgan_at_exesolutions.com> wrote in message news:<3E021193.B03F7B4D_at_exesolutions.com>...
> > Joel Garry wrote:
> >
> > > I used to think that (in the advocacy groups in the mid-90's I was
> > > quite vocal and biased about it), but I was hoping the percentage had
> > > increased. With optimism like that, I should probably sell real
> > > estate :-)
> > >
> > > But more seriously, what I have seen over the last several years is
> > > the cumulative results of both "microsoftization" and the related
> > > problem of Oracle trying to emulate it. So one must be able to use
> > > OEM with alacrity when walking into some random shop where there is a
> > > high percentage of less experienced admins adhering to the party line.
> > > They expect you to know it, and expect pretty pictures out of
> > > Performance Manager and instant solutions to locking issues. So to
> > > me, it seems necessary both to know OEM and to know its limitations.
> > > Being able to make it screw itself with just a few commands is just
> > > gravy for impressing the newbies.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Daniel Morgan
> > > > http://www.outreach.washington.edu/extinfo/certprog/oad/oad_crs.asp
> > >
> > > jg
> > > --
> > > @home is bogus
> > > My year-old 300M got rear-ended today. Was it the head of Ford
> > > Premier Auto Group? Nooooo. Was it the owner of House of Mercedes?
> > > Nooooo. Was it the manager of Newport Imports? Nooooo. It was the
> > > CEO of Kia America. Figures.
> >
> > Part of the interviewing process is setting expectations. When I am interviewed I make it known that my
> > requirement for accepting a position extends beyond just a paycheck. I insist on access to the entire data
> > dictionary, I insist on the ability to use SQL*Plus rather than some GUI they've chosen ... usually TOAD
> > not that I have anything against TOAD, and I insist on a change management process.

>

> Maybe some of us just don't have the cojones, but I know I'm not alone
> in thinking there is a buyer's market right now, and potential
> employers will use any excuse to slim down the list of many qualified
> applicants, including what may be reasonable demands.

>

> But then again, maybe some of us who aren't perfectly coiffed
> mannequins can be challenged by the, well, management-challenged
> environments. One man's hellhole may be another's opportunity. Or it
> may just be a hellhole. It is often difficult to tell from the
> outside. Of all the jobs I've had, certainly the top three best
> involved, more-or-less, someone saying "show up at this place and
> start working." And so did the worst (although the second-worst
> involved the traditional interviewing process, started off average and
> went downhill).

>


> >

> > If they can't handle that minimum requirement ... I don't want to work there. And I have on many
> > occassions exercised that by either not accepting a position or walking out on one at the first

>

> That was a heck of lot easier when I was a hotshot programmer with 2-4
> years of experience. One of those that met my demands, I didn't
> accept anyways because of the commute. Read about it in the papers
> later, $65 million fraud, inside job.

>

> > opportunity. A job that is more frustrating than rewarding is only of value if you have no other choice.

>

> That is the problem with a buyers slave-market.

>

> jg
> --
> @home is bogus.
> "In search of excess." Book by Graef Crystal, compensation expert.

It is not a question of body parts.

You don't get offers if you look desparate. You don't get offers with good compensation packages if you appear willing to take anything. Asking questions and indicating that their offer is not necessarily your acquiesence demonstrates a level of self-confidence in your skills. You set yourself up for misery if you don't lay down, right up front, what you expect on your end of the relationship; any relationship.

Daniel Morgan Received on Fri Dec 20 2002 - 11:22:45 CST