Re: 9i doc testimonials?

John,
Thank you for a clear and informative answer to my ramblings. It is so much easier to complain than it is to praise. Please, however, place my comments within the context of Oracle9i product + documentation being IMHO excellent.

George Barbour.

"John Russell" <netnews_at_johnrussell.mailshell.com> wrote in message news:4c2iutsl3mcjjsp7allgm8i771v57du19p_at_4ax.com...
> On Wed, 7 Nov 2001 09:55:39 -0000, "George Barbour" <gbarbour_at_csc.com>
> wrote:
>
> >John,
> > The "9i doc enhancements" are fine, but I wish they would not try to
jump
> >to Tahiti quite so much when the actual information I'm looking for is
held
> >locally on CD or disk, especially when I try a search.
>
> George, point taken.
>
> Most pathways on the doc CD do lead to the local files (list of books,
> master index, definitions of SQL statements, catalog views, glossary
> items, etc.) However the search is the most "eye-catching" and that
> does use an Internet connection.
>
> People also use various tools (Webreaper, Getright, etc.) to download
> parts of the site, and I can't testify how successful each tool is at
> setting up local links. I hope we can get a zipped version of the CD
> put up to save people kludging their own own methods of making a local
> copy.
>
> The Internet connection is because the search facility uses lots of
> stuff behind the scenes that most people would not like to configure
> themselves. (Many GB of available tablespace and lots of spare CPU to
> accomodate people searching for "the" and "a" :-); iAS with DAD set up
> to run stored procedures; Oracle Text; properly configured EXTPROC
> entry in tnsnames.ora; function-based indexes plus init.ora parameters
> and user privileges to enable them; DBAs installing appropriate patch
> sets; files located in a known path rather than on an arbitrary drive
> letter or Unix path; etc.)
>
> We measured success rates with and without search. With search,
> success was 100% on a set of problems similar in difficulty to OCP
> questions. Without, success was 87%, with people primarily using the
> master index.
>
> Another alternative is to use the Acrobat search facility within the
> individual PDF files, although I suspect that is not a widely known
> feature.
>
> Because we do emphasize interactivity with the external site, you can
> expect some extra features on that front, like personalization and
> perhaps someday custom-built PDFs. We are already using popularity
> data to fine-tune the content of frequently visited topics for future
> editions.
>
> Also, you'll find that new content becomes available on the site and
> is thus searchable from any doc CD or local copy, even if it wasn't
> present when the CD was cut or files downloaded. The 9i Windows docs
> have already appeared, and Windows + Unix install docs might appear
> sometime this week.
>
> >< set soap-box mode on>
> >However, Oracle is one of the richest companies in the word, your man
Larry
> >flaunts it.
> >So, where are the "real" Oracle manuals? I prefer hardcopy, my O7 & O8
> >manuals are dog-eared and overwritten by my own notes. For a company like
> >Oracle to save a few pennies by not sending manuals out with their
product
> >is mean. Expecting users to pay "extra" pennies for the manuals over and
> >above the software support and update fees doesn't enhance your company's
> >name here matey.
> >< set soap-box mode off>
>
> This is a subject of which we're aware. It's an area where I
> personally have less visibility, but that is changing by the day.
>
> Right now, I can just offer some thinking out loud:
>
> There is a bit of an "all or nothing" quandary. 107 manuals is too
> much to put in a box. Ordering the whole set from the Oracle Store
> would no doubt cost a pretty penny; even printing all the PDFs would
> run up paper and toner bills. Picking a subset is no simple matter --
> install docs, multiple volumes of Admin Guide, multiple volumes of SQL
> Reference...? Perhaps to be lost or tucked away on a bookshelf, far
> from the people who really use the software, like happens to many doc
> CDs.
>
> You might find any prepackaged docs to be aimed at a far less
> experienced audience than yourself, since those without dog-eared V7
> manuals are more prone to not knowing where to start.
>
> Again, it's only recently that we have lots of usage data from PDF
> downloads and search hits on the web site, to help us make judgments
> about how to improve the situation in future.
>
> <aside>I have had people tell me that the 9i online docs give them
> enough confidence to do away with their well-loved hardcopies. I've
> been hearing that promised for 15 years by a raft of companies, but
> never seen it come true until now.</aside>
>
> >A lot of folks, well I do anyway, carry a laptop with no available
internet
> >connections.
> >The laptop being used for notes and manuals etc; I therefore would like
you
> >to consider tailoring your notes/manuals to a stand alone machine.
> >
> >George Barbour.
> >Edinburgh.
>
> There are a couple of scenarios that we are trying to gather
> information about. Since we are looking for first-hand accounts,
> anyone who is in one of these boats and would like to express an
> opinion or have a dialog should drop me a line at work (john.russell @
> oracle.com).
>
> It sounds like you are in the "consultant" mode where you'll be
> working at various sites, and you'll have the wherewithal and
> motivation to do a bit of configuration if needed to get things
> running locally.
>
> Another possible scenario is the "high-security" site where access to
> external sites is prohibited. The solution in this case might be very
> different from above, so it's important for us to understand which
> situation is more common, which is more serious, and all the
> complicating factors with each one.
>
> In this scenario, maybe an IT group would want to set up a centralized
> copy of the doc web site, including search capability. Hard to tell
> how practical and realistic that is:
>
> - We usually only hear about this as a hypothetical situation via
> third-hand reports.
> - Server logs show hits from the kinds of places that are reputed to
> have restricted Internet access.
> - People might look stuff up using their personal AOL accounts, or a
> non-mission-critical computer at work. Or order or print hardcopies.
> - Not clear how much motivation an IT group would have to configure
> anything so that users can do an occasional doc search. (Assuming
> they are aware of the existence of online docs at all.)
>
> Thanks,
> John
>
> >"John Russell" <netnews_at_johnrussell.mailshell.com> wrote in message
> >news:2pteuto7t0uat28f415o4t2r59i4ua729t_at_4ax.com...
> >> In Oracle9i, we did a makeover for the online database docs that you
> >> can see at http://tahiti.oracle.com. (With similar changes retrofit
> >> for the 8i docs, available at the same site.)
> >>
> >> For this year's OOW, we'll have a demo at the campground and would
> >> like to get some feedback from customers who have seen some benefit
> >> from the 9i doc enhancements -- learned about new features, found
> >> information through the search engine, saved time from redesigned
> >> features like the list of books or new features like the SQL / PL/SQL
> >> / SQL*Plus combined reference, and so on.
> >>
> >> If you have had positive experiences such as these [specifically with
> >> the 9i docs] and wouldn't mind being quoted, please drop me a line at
> >> john.russell @ oracle.com.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> John
> >
>
> --
> Got an Oracle database question?
> Try the search engine for the database docs at:
> http://tahiti.oracle.com/
Received on Wed Nov 07 2001 - 09:20:48 CST