Re: Oracle Certification

From: Daniel Morgan <damorgan_at_x.washington.edu>
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:23:29 -0800
Message-ID: <1080109387.714273@yasure>

Hans Forbrich wrote:

> Daniel Morgan wrote:
>
>

>>Right now, unfortunately, there are not a lot of alternatives and
>>that is a major problem I am working to rectify. Two days from now,
>>Thursday to be exact, I will be at a major California university,
>>trying to help them move away from an OCP based education system
>>(BTW enrollment has dropped like a stone in recent years) to one that
>>provides career based education. I have also been approached by a
>>technology focused college in Arizona too.

>
>
> This is most encouraging, in a limited fashion. (For example, it definitely
> does not address the non-US market.)

One step at a time. I'm going to invest in Alberta Oil Sands soon. ;-)

> Personally I'd rather see an Oracle led/supported/endorsed/funded solution.

That would kill it, or devalue it, for the same reason it has done so with the OCP. Education needs to be for the pure purpose of education. Not with an ROI attached: Something any unit of Oracle Corp. must, by necessity, have.

> That is unlikely, given the threads on Oracle's Support, Education and
> Consulting deficiencies we've seen in the past few months. (And in doing
> so, Oracle is only hurting themselves.)

In a sense I agree. What Oracle could do that would best serve the long-term purposes of Oracle would be to make education grants to universities that demonstrate the expertise required to teach not just the Oracle product ... but rather how to address business problems using their tools. Students that learn to solve business problems with spreadsheets use spreadsheets. Those that learn to solve problems with a specific RDBMS, in a setting that teaches multiversion read and write consistency will want to buy that with which they are most familiar and comfortable.

Doing this, unfortunately, requires a committment to long-term benefit rather than "how are we doing this quarter" which is the usual mode of operation for US Corporations.

>>Does this mean there isn't some value in the OCP? In my opinion there
>>is none. Yes there is learning there. But there is also learning of
>>information that is incorrect. And students are in no place to make
>>the determination of what is correct and what is not.

>
> One possible solution to this - let us start a thread (or continue this
> thread) with a list of all the OCP (or at least OCP curriculum)
> inaccuracies that are known. Possibly using the thread title "Known issues
> with OCP material and curricula".

I think there has been a citing of many many examples. Some I've posted. Others by Jonathan Lewis, Howard Rogers, and others with far more knowledge and expertise than I can bring to bear.

The problem is that so many of the mistakes are eggregious. For example the statement in the 9i OCP that you can't put an ORDER BY clause on a view. That isn't a question of judgement or interpretation: It is just plain wrong.

>>This is not to say that I don't make mistakes: More than I'd care to
>>admit. But the difference between the two approaches are enormous.
>>Consider the implications of a school that had no patients, no
>>physicians, but taught people how to answer the questions on a state
>>or provincial medical exam. Is this the person you'd want as your
>>surgeon? I think not.

>
> Under normal circumstances, no. However, if it's a choice of a totally
> inexperienced passer-by and someone who has book-learnin', I'd lean toward
> the book-learnin'.

I would too. But in the current marketplace there is an overabundance of talent. At least talent as defined by years of experience on a resume. The last thing the marketplace needs is more with faux-experience. I know you are in Alberta so I can address your marketplace directly. I know more than a half-dozen Oracle professionals from Calgary and Edmonton that are currently at AT&T Wireless in Redmond Washington because they can't find work at home and they are not in the US by preference.

By rejecting the only available alternative, we are
> backing ourselves into the passer-by-only corner. However, I'd really,
> really hope the book they used to learned was right!!!

When we again experience of shortage of employee prospects I hope we don't again make the mistake of employing anyone, or any thing, that can breathe air and spell the name Oracle which is what we saw here in the Puget Sound area. And, quite frankly, part of what has fueled the move to offshoring jobs.

> Back to the OCP inaccuracies ........
>
> So let's do something about it! Can we start a list of known mstakes?
>
> /Hans

Go for it. I'll add list to the thread.

-- 
Daniel Morgan
http://www.outreach.washington.edu/ext/certificates/oad/oad_crs.asp
http://www.outreach.washington.edu/ext/certificates/aoa/aoa_crs.asp
damorgan_at_x.washington.edu
(replace 'x' with a 'u' to reply)

Received on Wed Mar 24 2004 - 00:23:29 CST