Re: Upgrading with no patches in the "base"?

In my experience (and I don't mostly deal with COTS things any more) people never went back and repeated verification tests for security patches. They either a) didn't apply security patches or b) treated them as low risk and tested by running them in prod.

On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 4:29 PM <dimensional.dba_at_comcast.net> wrote:

> In the real world with COTS application line 2 is performed everytime a
> new security patch is applied.
>
>
>
> *From:* oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org <oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org> *On
> Behalf Of *niall.litchfield_at_gmail.com
> *Sent:* Friday, January 8, 2021 7:44 AM
> *To:* Frits Hoogland <frits.hoogland_at_gmail.com>
> *Cc:* Mark Bobak <mark_at_bobak.net>; Noveljic Nenad <
> nenad.noveljic_at_vontobel.com>; mkline1_at_comcast.net; ORACLE-L <
> oracle-l_at_freelists.org>
> *Subject:* Re: Upgrading with no patches in the "base"?
>
>
>
> I can see it making sense from an application vendor perspective. I'd be
> extremely reluctant to certify against RU1, RU2, RU3, RU4, RU5, etc -
> especially as I suspect a number of customers would actually end up with
> RU2 + One-Off 123. . Instead, I'd certify and then support the major
> version.
>
> In that world as a customer of the application vendor the original
> approach makes sense as follows:
>
>
>
> 1. Validate that my application vendor has done due diligence and it
> really works in my environment via a full regression test, This verifies
> that I've configured the app properly as well.
> 2. Patch in line with security recommendations and do minimal
> functional testing.
>
> Not many people live in a world like that, especially as line 2 probably
> then needs repeating every 3-6 months.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 3:36 PM Frits Hoogland <frits.hoogland_at_gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> the only way the visit to the unpatched version makes sense, is when the
> intention is to never leave that version. which doesn’t make sense in
> today’s world.
>
> there is no sensible, logical other way in which using the unpatched
> version otherwise makes sense with the given information.
>
>
> Frits Hoogland
>
> http://fritshoogland.wordpress.com
> frits.hoogland_at_gmail.com
>
> Mobile: +31 6 14180860
>
>
>
> On 8 Jan 2021, at 16:27, Mark J. Bobak <mark_at_bobak.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> "They will test this for a while, and if everything is fine, THEN they
> will apply the patch."
>
>
>
> And what if everything *isn't* fine? Then they *won't* apply the patch?
>
>
>
> Doesn't make sense.
>
>
>
> -Mark
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 10:19 AM Noveljic Nenad <
> nenad.noveljic_at_vontobel.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Michael,
>
>
>
> That sounds like black magic.
>
>
>
> If “for a while” implies two different maintenance windows, you end up
> with two test cycles and two disruptions instead of just one. If you get
> the opportunity to combat these voodoo practitioners in front of the
> management, the most persuasive argument would be that the database will be
> running without security and other critical patches for a while. Who’s
> going to take that risk?
>
>
>
> Last but not least, why not 19c?
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Nenad
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org <oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org> *On
> Behalf Of *Michael Kline
> *Sent:* Freitag, 8. Januar 2021 15:29
> *To:* 'ORACLE-L' <oracle-l_at_freelists.org>
> *Subject:* Upgrading with no patches in the "base"?
>
>
>
> Hearing that an application is going to be upgraded from 12.1 to 12.2.
>
>
>
> Vendor is saying they will create a “blank, no patched” 12.2 $ORACLE_HOME,
> and then upgrade the database.
>
>
>
> They will test this for a while, and if everything is fine, THEN they will
> apply the patch.
>
>
>
> I’ve never heard of such a thing and have been working on Oracle databases
> since 1983, version 4.0.
>
>
>
> Is there logic in this? We try to keep all databases at N-1 on patching.
>
>
>
>
>
> *Michael Kline*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
> Niall Litchfield
> Oracle DBA
> http://www.orawin.info
>

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Niall Litchfield
Oracle DBA
http://www.orawin.info

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