RE: Standy database on standard edition
Date: Fri, 14 Jun 2013 10:27:55 -0400
Message-ID: <C1117B1AA0340645894671E09A7891F71511DF6F3A_at_EIHQEXVM2.ei.local>
Job,
Thank you very much for this. I believe it will help me immensely.
Joel Patterson
Database Administrator
904 928-2790
From: Job Miller [mailto:jobmiller_at_yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, June 14, 2013 10:15 AM
To: Patterson, Joel; dbvision_at_iinet.net.au; oracle-l_at_freelists.org
Subject: Re: Standy database on standard edition
You can read more about the ESL agreement here:
http://www.oracle.com/ocom/groups/public/_at_opnpublic/documents/webcontent/034727.pdf
Page 1-2 has the 11 restrictive points that an ESL must comply with.
Read the first few I bolded below and you'll understand what the vendor is telling you.
The term embedded refers to the following requirements, with which the application package must comply:
(i) The programs must be packaged, installed, and configured as an integrated component on the application
programs product media or set of media. When loading the software, the application software must launch the
Oracle Universal Installer (OUI) in silent mode to install the programs. The application package must include pre-set
configurations for the programs you are embedding. The end user must not be permitted to install or configure the
programs separately and independently from the application package;
(ii) The application program must be designed and developed by you to eliminate program administration tasks by
the end user by including all program administration functions within the application program. You may not
customize the application package for a single end user or a group of end users. All administration scripts including
startup, shutdown, and backup are to be provided by you within the application program. The end user must not be
permitted to access the programs directly but rather only through the application program;
(iii) All information from the programs must be accessed by the end user either through prepackaged reports, or add
hoc reports that are developed by you, and included in the application package, which do not require or permit the
end user to navigate the underlying data schema. If you include Oracle or third party reporting tools in the
application package, such tools must be embedded in the application package pursuant to the terms of this
agreement
(iv) If the application package must interface with another application or database, the end user is not permitted to
access the database to establish the transfer of data. You must set up predefined APIs to transfer data in the
application package and management of the data transfer must be done through the application program;
(v) If you include Oracle or third party database tools in the application package, such tools must be embedded in
the application package pursuant to the terms of this agreement. The end user may not be permitted to use such
tools to access the programs directly, rather all access must be provided by you within the application program;
(vi) You may embed Java Edition with your application program under the terms of this agreement at no charge only
if your application package uses the OC4J J2EE Server as a component of your application package. You may
embed Java Edition with your application program under the terms of this agreement at no charge only if your
application package uses the OC4J J2EE Server as a component of your application package;
(vii) Program upgrades must be certified and distributed as a component of the application package and the end user
shall be unable to upgrade the database or other Oracle program technology versions as a separate component;
(viii) As you deem necessary, you will provide customer service, support, and education for all program operations to
the end user. If you discontinue providing customer service, support, or education for your application package to
the end user, Oracle will not be obligated to provide ongoing service, support, or education to the end user. You will
notify Oracle of your intention to discontinue any support services provided by you to the end user;
(ix) Only you can access the programs directly for purposes of technical assistance to your end user and such access
is limited to providing technical assistance, including troubleshooting, problem resolution, and support assistance.
You shall not provide remote or onsite program administration tasks on behalf of the end user that are otherwise
prohibited under the terms of this agreement;
(x) The embedded programs and the application program must be priced together on your standard price list and on
the end users invoice as the price of the application package, and must not be distributed separately; and
(xi) The application program(s) described on the applicable application package registration form and with which the
programs are embedded must not be distributed under any other Oracle distribution agreement.
or here:
http://www.orafaq.com/wiki/Oracle_licensing#Embedded_Software_License
From: "Patterson, Joel" <jpatterson_at_entint.com<mailto:jpatterson_at_entint.com>> To: "dbvision_at_iinet.net.au<mailto:dbvision_at_iinet.net.au>" <dbvision_at_iinet.net.au<mailto:dbvision_at_iinet.net.au>>; "oracle-l_at_freelists.org<mailto:oracle-l_at_freelists.org>" <oracle-l_at_freelists.org<mailto:oracle-l_at_freelists.org>> Sent: Friday, June 14, 2013 9:46 AM
Subject: RE: Standy database on standard edition
The SR analyst has essentially sent me to http://docs.oracle.com/cd/E11882_01/license.112/e10594/editions.htm which was not entirely unexpected. So I'm pushing back to see if I can get a commitment. It is rather a mute point at the moment since Data Guard is not available on Standard Edition.
As to your remarks, I thought someone would say that. It's a windows machine and when the services start the database starts. He has some tools that creates the database, and/or exports/imports his schema, so it sounds like the product is as self-contained as possible.
I mentioned early on that it is an embedded license so the application and the database are sold as a licensed unit. Vendor sells to client, client doesn't want to do the care and feeding. It is apparently very restricted but with caveats for 'automated' processes, or 3rd party processes or something to that affect.
Just remember, I don't know what the details are, and I am not communicating directly, but indirectly, and I am sure that something is being left out or lost in translation -- I was just curious for some clarifications and opinions, especially since Data Guard and standby are very close. One is just better at doing the job.
Joel Patterson
Database Administrator
904 928-2790
-- Joel Patterson Sr. Database Administrator | Enterprise Integration Phone: 904-928-2790 | Fax: 904-733-4916 http://www.entint.com/ http://www.entint.com/ http://www.facebook.com/pages/Enterprise-Integration/212351215444231 http://twitter.com/#!/entint http://www.linkedin.com/company/18276?trk=tyah http://www.youtube.com/user/ValueofIT This message (and any associated files) is intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright or constitutes a trade secret. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, copying or distribution of this message, or files associated with this message, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Messages sent to and from us may be monitored. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the company. [v.1.1] From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org<mailto:oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org> [mailto:oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org<mailto:oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org>] On Behalf Of Nuno Souto Sent: Friday, June 14, 2013 8:19 AM To: oracle-l_at_freelists.org<mailto:oracle-l_at_freelists.org> Subject: Re: Standy database on standard edition On 14/06/2013 9:37 PM, Patterson, Joel wrote: > Its news to me. I don't talk to the vendor, or the client directly -- but doubt if I would argue against his licensing opinions even if I suspect they are misplaced. He says even sqlplus cannot be used... That would indeed be a first in Oracle licensing! sqlplus is essential to start and shutdown and manage the db, even if OEM is being used. I suspect there is something else weird going on there. Perhaps the Oracle licensing was provided as an embedded part of a third party application from the supplier? If so, then indeed the licensing will be very restricted. As in: nothing but the kernel code will be licensed. > ??? > > Backups can be done by a 3rd party tool which could mean home grown or purchased I suppose -- but not rman... I'm just not going there, it is what it is. > Yeah, if it is an embedded license you'll need a third party tool for just about everything. Very weird, I didn't know Oracle was still doing that sort of thing. Was all the rage back in the 80s but people wised up after that. -- Cheers Nuno Souto dbvision_at_iinet.net.au<mailto:dbvision_at_iinet.net.au> -- http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l -- http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l -- Joel Patterson Sr. Database Administrator | Enterprise Integration Phone: 904-928-2790 | Fax: 904-733-4916 www.entint.com<http://www.entint.com/> [http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb367/Entint/signaturev61.jpg]<http://www.entint.com/> [http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb367/Entint/th_FaceBook1.jpg]<http://www.facebook.com/pages/Enterprise-Integration/212351215444231> [http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb367/Entint/th_Twitter1.jpg] <http://twitter.com/#!/entint> [http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb367/Entint/th_LinkedIn1.jpg] <http://www.linkedin.com/company/18276?trk=tyah> [http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb367/Entint/th_YouTube1.jpg] <http://www.youtube.com/user/ValueofIT> This message (and any associated files) is intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright or constitutes a trade secret. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, copying or distribution of this message, or files associated with this message, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Messages sent to and from us may be monitored. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the company. [v.1.1] -- http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-lReceived on Fri Jun 14 2013 - 16:27:55 CEST
