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Re: Database in depth, by C.J. Date

From: Chris Stephens <>
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 10:49:04 -0400
Message-ID: <>

well, i'm on the last 2 chapters of 'database in depth.' be honest, i struggled through it. not because it was all that difficult to follow. i am very glad that I read it as it really got me to think about databases in a different light and there was a lot of good information that i hope to not forget. ...but in between that stuff there was a lot of dryness that lulled me to sleep and, consequently, i'm sure i didn't fully absorb. i for one am glad there wasn't a lot more math. not everyone sees magic in numbers.

....i realize in some peoples eyes that may qualify me as not being a 'real' database professional but...well...oh well. i'm comfortable with my progress. :)

i would still highly recommend the book though.

On 6/13/05, Lex de Haan <> wrote:
> If you really like mathematics, like Mladen and me, Chris' book is indeed=
> "thin". I agree.
> I think it is incredible to write a good book about this stuff in only 24=
0 pages
> -- then you have to make some tough decisions here and there. Also, don't=
> Chris wrote this book with a one day seminar in mind...
> For more formal stuff, you might want to read his thicker books, like his
> wellknown "Introduction to Database Systems" or (even better) the "Third
> Manifesto", as a foundation for future database systems.


> Then, for the real fanatics, I would recommend "Foundations of Semantic
> Databases" by Bert de Brock, published by Prentice Hall (ISBN 0-13-327099=
> That's the real stuff, without any compromises. I love it. I only know a =
> people who share that opinion with me, by the way.

> kind regards,

> Lex.

> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> Steve Adams Seminar
> ------------------------------------------------------------------

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [
] On
> Behalf Of Mladen Gogala
> Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 20:00
> To: Oracle-L (E-mail)
> Subject: Database in depth, by C.J. Date
> I owe this post to Mr. Lex de Haan with whom I was bantering when he reco=
> the book.
> The book should be entitled "An Introduction to Relational Theory for an
> obnoxious know-it-all Oracle DBA".
> Book is written in a very clear and easy to understand fashion. It gives =
> general overview of the theory and states the principles, rules and goals=
. That
> is all very nice. My only objection to the book is that it failed to esta=
> connection to the strictly mathematical foundations of the theory. Relati=
on is,
> strictly speaking, a subset of Cartesian product - any subset is a relati=
> Mathematics knows many relation types:
> symmetric,transitive,antisymmetric, relation of ordering and alike.
> None of them are mentioned. Union and intersect are set theory operations=
. None
> of the set theory was mentioned in its strict, formal form which I find
> unacceptable when explaining a theory that is essentially a part of mathe=
> set theory. Axiom of choice, Zorn's lemma and well-ordering theorem are n=
> necessary to mention and explain in a book for a "database professional" =
but, in
> my opinion, the author did shy away too much from using mathematics.
> Cary Millsap did not make such mistake.
> I don't want to keep this esteemed audience under suspense any longer:
> yes, I am a mathematician, with college
> in mathematics. The book is good, but it needs more math.

> --
> Mladen Gogala
> Oracle DBA
> Ext. 121

> --

> --
Received on Tue Jun 14 2005 - 10:54:14 CDT

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