From oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 11 23:41:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from air189.startdedicated.com (root@localhost) by orafaq.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i5C4f6K30334 for ; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:41:16 -0500 X-ClientAddr: 206.53.239.180 Received: from turing.freelists.org (freelists-180.iquest.net [206.53.239.180]) by air189.startdedicated.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i5C4eu630317 for ; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:41:06 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9154272C4AD; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 21844-10; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D36EE72C45A; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:26:09 -0500 (EST) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list oracle-l); Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:24:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: oracle-l@freelists.org Delivered-To: oracle-l@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D7BDE72C3D7 for ; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:24:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 04257-91 for ; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:24:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from lakermmtao09.cox.net (lakermmtao09.cox.net [68.230.240.30]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 674AC72C31F for ; Fri, 11 Jun 2004 23:24:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from dilbert ([68.96.142.184]) by lakermmtao09.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.03.02 201-2131-111-104-20040324) with SMTP id <20040612044432.VJXZ24996.lakermmtao09.cox.net@dilbert> for ; Sat, 12 Jun 2004 00:44:32 -0400 Message-ID: <01e701c450ad$607c9c40$6401a8c0@dilbert> From: "Don Granaman" To: References: <015b01c44f59$9842e120$6701a8c0@CVMLAP02> Subject: Re: Stop defragmenting and start ... Date: Sat, 12 Jun 2004 00:44:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at freelists.org X-archive-position: 2609 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org Errors-To: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: granaman@cox.net Precedence: normal Reply-To: oracle-l@freelists.org X-list: oracle-l X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at freelists.org X-Orig-Date: Sat, 12 Jun 2004 11:45:04 -0700 Cary's paper is the first such that I remember. It served as validation - that I wasn't a raving radical (at least not in that respect). I started doing "uniform extents" per tablespace in about 1991/1992 - within a year or so of when we got Oracle6 (with the TPO option!). [It wasn't divine inspiration then - a co-worker suggested it after we encountered some "fragmented free space" issues and it just made sense.] At the time the "recommended practice" was to size the initial extent large enough to hold all the initial data and the next extent significantly smaller - with a number of variations on the theme. "Recommended practice" then was also to "export/import to compress extents". Of course, this is when backups were always cold backups and users logged off and went home at 5 PM. There were a number of such papers between Cary's and the "Stop Defragmenting and Start Living" (SDSL) paper, but they all seem to have been forgotten - the latter is the one you always hear about. I would say that it became "recommended practice" to set pctincrease 0 the first time you seriously considered the alternative - especially the default of pctincrease 50! This is similar to the "tuning revolution" discussion of a couple of years ago. Good ideas and sound logic rarely prevail immediately on merit alone. They have to marinate in slow growth praxis, then there is a sort of community sense of profound revelation when they finally become generally accepted. For the death of the BCHR and such as the holy grail of tuning, that was IOUG-A Live! 2002 (?2001?). For uniform extents, I think it was about 1997/1998. Speaking of uniform extents... I anyone else annoyed at the way that ASSM does extent sizing - and can waste a *lot* of space in multi-datafile tablespaces with large objects? Its the best argument I've seen yet for monster datafiles ;-) -Don Granaman uniformly sized OraSaurus ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cary Millsap" To: Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 7:12 PM Subject: RE: Stop defragmenting and start ... > I originally wrote this in 1994 as an engagement summary document for a > power company in Colorado. I don't have the exact date anymore. > > > Cary Millsap > Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd. > http://www.hotsos.com > * Nullius in verba * > > Upcoming events: > - Performance Diagnosis 101: 6/22 Pittsburgh, 7/20 Cleveland, 8/10 Boston > - SQL Optimization 101: 5/24 San Diego, 6/14 Chicago, 6/28 Denver > - Hotsos Symposium 2005: March 6-10 Dallas > - Visit www.hotsos.com for schedule details... > > > -----Original Message----- > From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org] > On Behalf Of Wolfgang Breitling > Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 2:13 PM > To: oracle-l@freelists.org > Subject: RE: Stop defragmenting and start ... > > My copy of Cary's paper "Oracle7 Server Space Management - An Oracle > Services > Advanced Technologies Research Paper", which was my first encounter with the > > concept of uniform extents - and a certain Cary Millsap - is dated "Revision > > 1.4b (95/10/31)" > I was immediately hooked and converted. > > Quoting Lex de Haan : > > > Robyn, > > > > I quickly checked my courseware archives, > > and for sure Cary Millsap talked about uniform extent sizes in 1996. > > to be more precise: he probably talked about this even before 1996, > > but my private collection does not contain any hard evidence :-) > > > > Kind regards, > > Lex. > > > > --------------------------------------------- > > visit my website at http://www.naturaljoin.nl > > --------------------------------------------- > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org > > [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On Behalf Of Robyn > > Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 16:02 > > To: oracle-l@freelists.org > > Subject: Stop defragmenting and start ... > > > > > > Hello, > > > > Can someone tell me when uniform extent sizing became a recommended > > practice? The 'Stop defragmenting and Start Living' paper has a copyright > > date of 1998, and I remember implementing it on some databases back in > > 1999, but I was wondering if it there were earlier references to this > > approach. > > > > Robyn > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org > > put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. > > -- > > Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ > > FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > -- > regards > > Wolfgang Breitling, > Oracle 7,8,8i,9i OCP DBA; Oaktable member > Centrex Consulting Corporation > www.centrexcc.com > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org > put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. > -- > Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ > FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org > put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. > -- > Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ > FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. -- Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html -----------------------------------------------------------------