From oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org Wed Mar 24 06:58:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from air189.startdedicated.com (root@localhost) by orafaq.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2OCw0v21635 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 06:58:00 -0600 X-ClientAddr: 206.53.239.180 Received: from turing.freelists.org (freelists-180.iquest.net [206.53.239.180]) by air189.startdedicated.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2OCvpo21597 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 06:57:51 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 59D49390077; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:54:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 11851-82; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:54:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 33CCB390B4B; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:54:03 -0500 (EST) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list oracle-l); Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:52:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: oracle-l@freelists.org Delivered-To: oracle-l@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E981F3908E6 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:52:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 12139-52 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:52:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from dns21.dfas.mil (DNS21.dfas.mil [207.133.68.245]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2AEE33908C8 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:52:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from ckc-e2-w-2.DS.DFAS.MIL (ckc-e2-w-2.ds.dfas.mil [207.132.194.73]) by dns21.dfas.mil with ESMTP id i2OD1dL7011715 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:01:39 -0600 (CST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C4119F.E21864CD" Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 06:59:46 -0600 Message-ID: <7BF02D2647E8EE4980BA85173949479E03F85EFC@ckc-e2-w-2.ds.dfas.mil> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? Thread-Index: AcQRIdDG+3f8RCewRdWEqboH5kLjtQAfdK0A From: "TOMPKINS, MARGARET" To: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at freelists.org X-archive-position: 1673 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org Errors-To: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: MARGARET.TOMPKINS@DFAS.MIL Precedence: normal Reply-To: oracle-l@freelists.org X-list: oracle-l X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at freelists.org ------_=_NextPart_001_01C4119F.E21864CD Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm familiar with the OCM. I know of one company, ITC2, that is = starting to do experienced based certifications and was wondering if = there were others out there. Maggie=20 =20 -----Original Message----- From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On Behalf Of Lex de Haan Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 2:19 PM To: oracle-l@freelists.org Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? I think you are referring to the OCM programme -- Oracle Certified = Masters. that's a tough one indeed, and it involves some real problem = scenarios to be solved, on a standalone Linux box, under quite some time = pressure. it is not cheap, though, and there are only a limited number = of places where you can take those exams. search for OU and = certification on the Oracle website, and I guess you will find more info = ... =20 hope this helps, kind regards, Lex. -----Original Message----- From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On Behalf Of TOMPKINS, MARGARET Sent: dinsdag 23 maart 2004 20:33 To: oracle-l@freelists.org Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? I'm starting to see some experienced based certifications. They are = case studies reviewed by experts. It would be more like an essay exam = than multiple choice. Interviews are also a part of the process. Does = anyone have experience with those? Maggie Respectfully,=20 Maggie Tompkins - CAD SQA=20 Corporate Applications Division=20 Technology Services Organization - Kansas City=20 Defense Finance and Accounting Service=20 816-926-1117 (DSN 465); Margaret.Tompkins@dfas.mil=20 -----Original Message----- From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On Behalf Of Chris Stephens Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 12:41 PM To: 'oracle-l@freelists.org' Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? I wholeheartedly agree. ...but I think it is also true that even among = non-dba types, the legitimacy of the ocp is declining due to the fact = that there are so many people out there that pass the tests because they = have a 'question repository'. I remember trying to aquire the classroom = documentation via the internet because my company would not send me to = the classes (nor did I want to go to the class). In my search I came = across several dba forums where the exact questions and answers were = laid out for everyone to see. ...it's crap. ...it's also one of the = (probably too few) times in my life where I took the moral high road and = went on to the next google hit...often not before posting a nasty = message to the forum. =20 Hell...I studied the documentation from the classes and investigated = what I didn't understand via working through examples and referencing = the official documentation. I felt pretty good about getting the = certification and felt I was a fully competent dba. ...and then I = joined this list and realized just how little I knew. ...I shudder to = think what has happened at companies where some newly knighted ocp lands = a production dba gig with all the confidence that (sometimes) comes by = passing the tests. ...I struggle with not screwing things up as it = is! :-) =20 I know this has been discussed before.......but this hits home. I am = currently looking for a job and because I don't personally feel I'm at = the sr. dba level and as a result don't market myself as such, my resume = probably gets lumped in with a bunch of people who hold certifications = but can't do a d@mn thing!! ...and given the current market situation, = it's not a fun place to be! =20 Woo. That felt good. ...back to reading oracle design. ...thanks = mogens for reminding me just how good this book is! =20 chris =20 =20 -----Original Message----- From: Jared.Still@radisys.com [mailto:Jared.Still@radisys.com]=20 Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 11:40 AM To: oracle-l@freelists.org Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? =20 > ..if it has any value at all.=20 I must disagree with this statement.=20 True, it may have no value among your Oracle peers.=20 But I doubt that anyone here is getting it to impress their peers. We=20 all know better. Wrong answers, dumb questions, etc.=20 The OCP may be the deciding factor when applying for employment.=20 Check monster.com and dice.com. I have seen ads on several occasions=20 that *require* OCP.=20 It may also be tied to an individuals employment grade and/or salary = increase.=20 You just need to consider another perspective on the subject.=20 Jared=20 =20 Chris Stephens =20 Sent by: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org=20 03/23/2004 05:36 AM=20 Please respond to oracle-l=20 =20 To: "'oracle-l@freelists.org'" =20 cc: =20 Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , = Links , Docs ? And this is one of the reasons ocp gets to be less and less = valuable....if it has any value at all. ...study the database...not the questions. -----Original Message----- From: Kommareddy, Srinivas (MED, Wissen Infotech) [mailto:Srinivas.Kommareddy@med.ge.com]=20 Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:51 AM To: oracle-l@freelists.org; "'=3DSMTP:oracledba@lazydba.com'"@int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? Hi, Do you need an easy way ?=20 ping me personallly if you need the question bank. You willl get more = than 60-70% of the questions in the exam from this question bank. Thanks and Regads, Srinivas -----Original Message----- From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org] On Behalf Of VIVEK_SHARMA Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:04 PM To: oracle-l@freelists.org; LazyDBA.com Discussion Subject: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? Thanks ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. -- Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html ----------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. -- Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html ----------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. -- Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html -----------------------------------------------------------------=20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C4119F.E21864CD Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I'm=20 familiar with the OCM.  I know of one company, ITC2, that is = starting to do=20 experienced based certifications and was wondering if there were others = out=20 there.  Maggie 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: = oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org=20 [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On Behalf Of Lex de=20 Haan
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 2:19 PM
To:=20 oracle-l@freelists.org
Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any = Recommended=20 Books , Links , Docs ?

I=20 think you are referring to the OCM programme -- Oracle Certified = Masters. that's=20 a tough one indeed, and it involves some real problem scenarios to be = solved, on=20 a standalone Linux box, under quite some time pressure.  it is not = cheap,=20 though, and there are only a limited number of places where you can take = those=20 exams. search for OU and certification on the Oracle website, and I = guess you=20 will find more info ...
 
hope=20 this helps, kind regards,
Lex.
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On=20 Behalf Of TOMPKINS, MARGARET
Sent: dinsdag 23 maart 2004 = 20:33
To: oracle-l@freelists.org
Subject: RE: OCP=20 Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs = ?

I'm=20 starting to see some experienced based certifications.  They are = case=20 studies reviewed by experts.  It would be more like an essay exam = than=20 multiple choice.  Interviews are also a part of the = process.  Does=20 anyone have experience with those?  Maggie

Respectfully,
Maggie Tompkins - CAD SQA =
Corporate Applications = Division=20
Technology = Services=20 Organization - Kansas City
Defense Finance and Accounting Service
816-926-1117 (DSN 465);=20 Margaret.Tompkins@dfas.mil

-----Original Message-----
From:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On=20 Behalf Of Chris Stephens
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 = 12:41=20 PM
To: 'oracle-l@freelists.org'
Subject: RE: OCP=20 Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs = ?

I = wholeheartedly=20 agree.  ...but I think it is also true that even among non-dba = types, the=20 legitimacy of the ocp is declining due to the fact that there are so = many=20 people out there that pass the tests because they have a 'question=20 repository'.  I remember trying to aquire the classroom = documentation via=20 the internet because my company would not send me to the classes (nor = did I=20 want to go to the class).  In my search I came across several dba = forums=20 where the exact questions and answers were laid out for everyone to = see. =20 ...it's crap.  ...it's also one of the (probably too few) times = in my=20 life where I took the moral high road and went on to the next google=20 hit...often not before posting a nasty message to the = forum.

 

Hell...I = studied the=20 documentation from the classes and investigated what I didn't = understand via=20 working through examples and referencing the official = documentation.  I=20 felt pretty good about getting the certification and felt I was a = fully=20 competent dba.  ...and then I joined this list and realized just = how=20 little I knew.  ...I shudder to think what has happened at = companies=20 where some newly knighted ocp lands a production dba gig with all the=20 confidence that (sometimes) comes by passing the = tests.    ...I=20 struggle with not screwing things up as it is! J

 

I know this = has been=20 discussed before.......but this hits home.  I am currently = looking for a=20 job and because I don't personally feel I'm at the sr. dba level and = as a=20 result don't market myself as such, my resume probably gets lumped in = with a=20  bunch of people who hold certifications but can't do a d@mn=20 thing!!  ...and given the current market situation, it's not a = fun place=20 to be!

 

Woo.  = That felt=20 good.  ...back to reading oracle design.  ...thanks mogens = for=20 reminding me just how good this book is!

 

chris

 

 

-----Original=20 Message-----
From:=20 Jared.Still@radisys.com [mailto:Jared.Still@radisys.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 = 11:40=20 AM
To:=20 oracle-l@freelists.org
Subject: RE: OCP Preperation = -Any=20 Recommended Books , Links , Docs ?

 


> ..if it=20 has any value at all.

I must disagree = with this=20 statement.

True, it may have = no value=20 among your Oracle peers.

But = I doubt that=20 anyone here is getting it to impress their peers. =  We=20
all know better. =  Wrong=20 answers, dumb questions, etc.

The = OCP may be=20 the deciding factor when applying for employment. =

Check monster.com = and=20 dice.com.  I have seen ads on several occasions =
that *require*=20 OCP.

It may also be tied = to an=20 individuals employment grade and/or salary increase.=20

You just need to = consider=20 another perspective on the subject.

Jared =





 

Chris=20 Stephens <ChrisStephens@affina.com> =
Sent by:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org

 03/23/2004 05:36=20 AM
 Please = respond to=20 oracle-l

    =    =20
  =    =20   To:        "'oracle-l@freelists.org'" = <oracle-l@freelists.org>
 =20       cc:       =  =20
  =    =20   Subject:        RE: OCP Preperation = -Any=20 Recommended Books , Links , Docs = ?




And this is=20 one of the reasons ocp gets to be less and less valuable....if
it = has any=20 value at all.

...study the database...not the=20 questions.

-----Original Message-----
From: Kommareddy, = Srinivas=20 (MED, Wissen Infotech)
[mailto:Srinivas.Kommareddy@med.ge.com] =
Sent:=20 Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:51 AM
To:=20 = oracle-l@freelists.org;
"'=3DSMTP:oracledba@lazydba.com'"@int-nj2gw-1.= online-age.net
Subject:=20 RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs=20 ?

Hi,

Do you need an easy way ?

ping me = personallly if=20 you need the question bank. You willl get more than
60-70% of the = questions=20 in the exam from this question bank.

Thanks and=20 Regads,
Srinivas


-----Original Message-----
From:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]
On=20 Behalf Of VIVEK_SHARMA
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:04 PM
To: = oracle-l@freelists.org; LazyDBA.com Discussion
Subject: OCP = Preperation=20 -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs=20 = ?


Thanks
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