From oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org Tue Mar 23 15:52:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from air189.startdedicated.com (root@localhost) by orafaq.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2NLqYK29580 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:52:34 -0600 X-ClientAddr: 206.53.239.180 Received: from turing.freelists.org (freelists-180.iquest.net [206.53.239.180]) by air189.startdedicated.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2NLqSo29559 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:52:28 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4F67F3919EF; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:26:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02880-22; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:26:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id EF7A5391B52; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:15:38 -0500 (EST) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list oracle-l); Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:14:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: oracle-l@freelists.org Delivered-To: oracle-l@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4CCD939510D for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:06:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30441-36 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:06:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ha-smtp1.tiscali.nl (ha-smtp1.tiscali.nl [195.241.76.187]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8F002394ACD for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:50:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from LEXLAPTOP (82-168-217-228-bbxl.xdsl.tiscali.nl [82.168.217.228]) by ha-smtp1.tiscali.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id D45A542B28E for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:19:29 +0100 (CET) From: "Lex de Haan" To: Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:19:15 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004E_01C4111C.7EA007F0" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <7BF02D2647E8EE4980BA85173949479E03F85EF0@ckc-e2-w-2.ds.dfas.mil> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at freelists.org X-archive-position: 1608 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org Errors-To: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lex.de.haan@naturaljoin.nl Precedence: normal Reply-To: oracle-l@freelists.org X-list: oracle-l X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at freelists.org ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01C4111C.7EA007F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think you are referring to the OCM programme -- Oracle Certified Masters. that's a tough one indeed, and it involves some real problem scenarios to be solved, on a standalone Linux box, under quite some time pressure. it is not cheap, though, and there are only a limited number of places where you can take those exams. search for OU and certification on the Oracle website, and I guess you will find more info ... hope this helps, kind regards, Lex. -----Original Message----- From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On Behalf Of TOMPKINS, MARGARET Sent: dinsdag 23 maart 2004 20:33 To: oracle-l@freelists.org Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? I'm starting to see some experienced based certifications. They are case studies reviewed by experts. It would be more like an essay exam than multiple choice. Interviews are also a part of the process. Does anyone have experience with those? Maggie Respectfully, Maggie Tompkins - CAD SQA Corporate Applications Division Technology Services Organization - Kansas City Defense Finance and Accounting Service 816-926-1117 (DSN 465); Margaret.Tompkins@dfas.mil -----Original Message----- From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On Behalf Of Chris Stephens Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 12:41 PM To: 'oracle-l@freelists.org' Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? I wholeheartedly agree. ...but I think it is also true that even among non-dba types, the legitimacy of the ocp is declining due to the fact that there are so many people out there that pass the tests because they have a 'question repository'. I remember trying to aquire the classroom documentation via the internet because my company would not send me to the classes (nor did I want to go to the class). In my search I came across several dba forums where the exact questions and answers were laid out for everyone to see. ...it's crap. ...it's also one of the (probably too few) times in my life where I took the moral high road and went on to the next google hit...often not before posting a nasty message to the forum. Hell...I studied the documentation from the classes and investigated what I didn't understand via working through examples and referencing the official documentation. I felt pretty good about getting the certification and felt I was a fully competent dba. ...and then I joined this list and realized just how little I knew. ...I shudder to think what has happened at companies where some newly knighted ocp lands a production dba gig with all the confidence that (sometimes) comes by passing the tests. ...I struggle with not screwing things up as it is! J I know this has been discussed before.......but this hits home. I am currently looking for a job and because I don't personally feel I'm at the sr. dba level and as a result don't market myself as such, my resume probably gets lumped in with a bunch of people who hold certifications but can't do a d@mn thing!! ...and given the current market situation, it's not a fun place to be! Woo. That felt good. ...back to reading oracle design. ...thanks mogens for reminding me just how good this book is! chris -----Original Message----- From: Jared.Still@radisys.com [mailto:Jared.Still@radisys.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 11:40 AM To: oracle-l@freelists.org Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? > ..if it has any value at all. I must disagree with this statement. True, it may have no value among your Oracle peers. But I doubt that anyone here is getting it to impress their peers. We all know better. Wrong answers, dumb questions, etc. The OCP may be the deciding factor when applying for employment. Check monster.com and dice.com. I have seen ads on several occasions that *require* OCP. It may also be tied to an individuals employment grade and/or salary increase. You just need to consider another perspective on the subject. Jared Chris Stephens Sent by: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org 03/23/2004 05:36 AM Please respond to oracle-l To: "'oracle-l@freelists.org'" cc: Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? And this is one of the reasons ocp gets to be less and less valuable....if it has any value at all. ...study the database...not the questions. -----Original Message----- From: Kommareddy, Srinivas (MED, Wissen Infotech) [mailto:Srinivas.Kommareddy@med.ge.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:51 AM To: oracle-l@freelists.org; "'=SMTP:oracledba@lazydba.com'"@int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net Subject: RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? Hi, Do you need an easy way ? ping me personallly if you need the question bank. You willl get more than 60-70% of the questions in the exam from this question bank. Thanks and Regads, Srinivas -----Original Message----- From: oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org] On Behalf Of VIVEK_SHARMA Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:04 PM To: oracle-l@freelists.org; LazyDBA.com Discussion Subject: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs ? Thanks ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. -- Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html ----------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. -- Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html ----------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send email to: oracle-l-request@freelists.org put 'unsubscribe' in the subject line. -- Archives are at http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/ FAQ is at http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html ----------------------------------------------------------------- ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01C4111C.7EA007F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I=20 think you are referring to the OCM programme -- Oracle Certified = Masters. that's=20 a tough one indeed, and it involves some real problem scenarios to be = solved, on=20 a standalone Linux box, under quite some time pressure.  it is not = cheap,=20 though, and there are only a limited number of places where you can take = those=20 exams. search for OU and certification on the Oracle website, and I = guess you=20 will find more info ...
 
hope=20 this helps, kind regards,
Lex.
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On=20 Behalf Of TOMPKINS, MARGARET
Sent: dinsdag 23 maart 2004 = 20:33
To: oracle-l@freelists.org
Subject: RE: OCP=20 Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs = ?

I'm=20 starting to see some experienced based certifications.  They are = case=20 studies reviewed by experts.  It would be more like an essay exam = than=20 multiple choice.  Interviews are also a part of the = process.  Does=20 anyone have experience with those?  Maggie

Respectfully,
Maggie Tompkins - CAD SQA =
Corporate Applications = Division=20
Technology = Services=20 Organization - Kansas City
Defense Finance and Accounting Service
816-926-1117 (DSN 465);=20 Margaret.Tompkins@dfas.mil

-----Original Message-----
From:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]On=20 Behalf Of Chris Stephens
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 = 12:41=20 PM
To: 'oracle-l@freelists.org'
Subject: RE: OCP=20 Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs = ?

I = wholeheartedly=20 agree.  ...but I think it is also true that even among non-dba = types, the=20 legitimacy of the ocp is declining due to the fact that there are so = many=20 people out there that pass the tests because they have a 'question=20 repository'.  I remember trying to aquire the classroom = documentation via=20 the internet because my company would not send me to the classes (nor = did I=20 want to go to the class).  In my search I came across several dba = forums=20 where the exact questions and answers were laid out for everyone to = see. =20 ...it's crap.  ...it's also one of the (probably too few) times = in my=20 life where I took the moral high road and went on to the next google=20 hit...often not before posting a nasty message to the = forum.

 

Hell...I = studied the=20 documentation from the classes and investigated what I didn't = understand via=20 working through examples and referencing the official = documentation.  I=20 felt pretty good about getting the certification and felt I was a = fully=20 competent dba.  ...and then I joined this list and realized just = how=20 little I knew.  ...I shudder to think what has happened at = companies=20 where some newly knighted ocp lands a production dba gig with all the=20 confidence that (sometimes) comes by passing the = tests.    ...I=20 struggle with not screwing things up as it is! J

 

I know this = has been=20 discussed before.......but this hits home.  I am currently = looking for a=20 job and because I don't personally feel I'm at the sr. dba level and = as a=20 result don't market myself as such, my resume probably gets lumped in = with a=20  bunch of people who hold certifications but can't do a d@mn=20 thing!!  ...and given the current market situation, it's not a = fun place=20 to be!

 

Woo.  = That felt=20 good.  ...back to reading oracle design.  ...thanks mogens = for=20 reminding me just how good this book is!

 

chris

 

 

-----Original=20 Message-----
From:=20 Jared.Still@radisys.com [mailto:Jared.Still@radisys.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 = 11:40=20 AM
To:=20 oracle-l@freelists.org
Subject: RE: OCP Preperation = -Any=20 Recommended Books , Links , Docs ?

 


> ..if it=20 has any value at all.

I must disagree = with this=20 statement.

True, it may have = no value=20 among your Oracle peers.

But = I doubt that=20 anyone here is getting it to impress their peers. =  We=20
all know better. =  Wrong=20 answers, dumb questions, etc.

The = OCP may be=20 the deciding factor when applying for employment. =

Check monster.com = and=20 dice.com.  I have seen ads on several occasions =
that *require*=20 OCP.

It may also be tied = to an=20 individuals employment grade and/or salary increase.=20

You just need to = consider=20 another perspective on the subject.

Jared =





 

Chris=20 Stephens <ChrisStephens@affina.com> =
Sent by:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org

 03/23/2004 05:36=20 AM
 Please = respond to=20 oracle-l

    =    =20
  =    =20   To:        "'oracle-l@freelists.org'" = <oracle-l@freelists.org>
 =20       cc:       =  =20
  =    =20   Subject:        RE: OCP Preperation = -Any=20 Recommended Books , Links , Docs = ?




And this is=20 one of the reasons ocp gets to be less and less valuable....if
it = has any=20 value at all.

...study the database...not the=20 questions.

-----Original Message-----
From: Kommareddy, = Srinivas=20 (MED, Wissen Infotech)
[mailto:Srinivas.Kommareddy@med.ge.com] =
Sent:=20 Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:51 AM
To:=20 = oracle-l@freelists.org;
"'=3DSMTP:oracledba@lazydba.com'"@int-nj2gw-1.= online-age.net
Subject:=20 RE: OCP Preperation -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs=20 ?

Hi,

Do you need an easy way ?

ping me = personallly if=20 you need the question bank. You willl get more than
60-70% of the = questions=20 in the exam from this question bank.

Thanks and=20 Regads,
Srinivas


-----Original Message-----
From:=20 oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org = [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@freelists.org]
On=20 Behalf Of VIVEK_SHARMA
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:04 PM
To: = oracle-l@freelists.org; LazyDBA.com Discussion
Subject: OCP = Preperation=20 -Any Recommended Books , Links , Docs=20 = ?


Thanks
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