what is the bug?
>
> From: "Bellow, Bambi" <bbellow_at_chi.navtech.com>
> Date: 2003/10/20 Mon PM 02:04:26 EDT
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
> Subject: RE: RE: CBO, RBO and will v5 ever really go away?
>
> Unfortunately, our applications fall into the second category. And due to
> the complexity of the queries being run, attempting to turn on CBO also
> activates a bug for which Oracle has a fix in v10.1 but will not do a
> backport, and so, until we are ready to go to 10.1, we are stuck with RBO,
> and because we develop a commercial product in use by the general public,
> often in realtime situations (while people are driving their vehicles), our
> need for QA is extraordinarily high, and a change in underlying platform
> would trigger many many manmonths of labor. In short, if we were to
> schedule an upgrade for business purposes on our time schedule, it would be
> one thing, but we do not want to be forced into an upgrade by external
> circumstance (read: Oracle bug). So, RBO is for us at this juncture.
>
> Bambi.
> -----Original Message-----
> Sent: Monday, October 20, 2003 12:44 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> generally speaking there are two groups of people using the RBO.
>
> 1. The DBAs who have been around for 15 years and doesnt read release notes
> and doesnt feel the need to read release notes or documentation because he
> knows everything. He may have tried the CBO in 1995 and had 1-2 bad
> experiences.
>
> 2. People who have to because they are using off the shelf cross platform
> applications. They are required to use the RBO or their support contract for
> these products will be invalidated. They are generally using the RBO for a
> combination of 3 reasons.
>
> 1. They dont know what they are doing.
> 2. They have a 'layered complex view' model. that goes multi-levels deep,
> and has complex functions. They do this to make it easier to port to
> multiple types of databases and keep prices down. CBO doesnt work well in
> this condition.
> 3. They tuned for the RBO 10 years ago and do not want to spend the time or
> money tuning for the CBO because Oracle is just one of many databases that
> they port to. They are trying to keep costs down for small shops and have to
> really watch expenses. Most people who buy these applications dont have
> large budgets.
>
>
> >
> > From: "Stephane Paquette" <stephane.paquette_at_standardlife.ca>
> > Date: 2003/10/20 Mon PM 01:29:26 EDT
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
> > Subject: RE: CBO, RBO and will v5 ever really go away?
> >
> > 38 is my age, Mladen is 42
> >
> > Stephane
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > Bellow, Bambi
> > Sent: 20 octobre, 2003 13:04
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > Let's do the time warp again! 2003-1961=42... But, I liked 1999 better...
> > just a jump to the left...
> >
> > One thing about living in the past...
> > The rent sure is cheaper.
> >
> > Bambi (feeling that 38 is a spry young thang)
> > -----Original Message-----
> > Sent: Monday, October 20, 2003 11:44 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > Is 38 that old ???
> >
> > Stephane
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > Mladen Gogala
> > Sent: 17 octobre, 2003 18:00
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > Ah, another one who can claim experience. According to one of
> > the previous post it's a genuine gold mine these days. Being born
> > in the Jurassic (1961) has its advantages, but I have yet to find
> > them.
> > On 10/17/2003 05:29:31 PM, Stephane Paquette wrote:
> > > And also SQL*Loader will be rename to ODL (Oracle Data Loader)
> > >
> > > Stephane
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > Mladen Gogala
> > > Sent: 17 octobre, 2003 17:19
> > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > >
> > >
> > > Bambi, Oracle 5.1.22 was an exceptionally stable version of oracle,
> > > with very few parameters (names were "TABLES","INDEXES" and alike)
> > > and, as such will forever be committed to our memory.
> > > Furthermore, RBO is used in the data dictionary, just like the
> > > datatype
> > > LONG which has also, allegedly, been desupported but someone forgot
> > > to
> > > tell that to developers. There are things from V5.1.22 that I'm
> > > missing
> > > even today. There used to be something called "rpf/rpt" which was a
> > > very good thing for writing quick command line reports without huge
> > > and
> > > buggy gooey interface. I started learning the only other language
> > > that
> > > has formats and page handling and is not COBOL when rpt/rpf was taken
> > > away in 7.1 (your guess is correct, it's perl). In short, Oracle 5
> > > will
> > > never go away. I here that in version 11, SQL*Plus will be renamed to
> > > UFI (= User Friendly Interface) and there will be tools for
> > > generating
> > > simple forms called IAP, IAG and IAD...
> > > On 10/17/2003 04:54:25 PM, "Bellow, Bambi" wrote:
> > > > Friends --
> > > >
> > > > I just got back from a week of benchmarking and one of the "issues"
> > > > that
> > > > came out of it was, due to some rather, um, interesting, coding
> > > > techniques,
> > > > running schema level statistics both wrecked performance *and*
> > > > produced
> > > > Oracle Bug 2954921. So we had to remove the statistics before
> > > running
> > > > additional tests. Of course, RBO is being desupported soon, so we
> > > > really
> > > > ought to modify things. But, this brings up another issue. See,
> > > > Oracle
> > > > says, and here I am paraphrasing, of course, that...
> > > >
> > > > RBO is going to die. We're not supporting it anymore. Nope. Once
> > > > you get
> > > > off of 9.2, that's it. Finito. Hasta la vista, Ba-bee. Well, no,
> > > > it's not
> > > > really going away. YET. It will still be behind the scenes for
> > > > awhile. But
> > > > sooner or later, it's going to die. You've been warned. This
> > > isn't
> > > > going
> > > > to be like Forms2.3. No. We're serious this time. We put in all
> > > > these
> > > > great features that y'all aren't using because your code is
> > > dependent
> > > > on RBO
> > > > and RBO can't use these features and that sucks because we really
> > > > like
> > > > these
> > > > features. Now, we figure that a slim minority of people... maybe
> > > > 20%... are
> > > > still using RBO. 20%. Barely noticeable. (dinosaurs, grumble,
> > > > grumble)
> > > > Well, we're taking it away. We're going to drag you into the new
> > > > millenium
> > > > and you're going to use CBO. And you're going to like it. We'll
> > > > leave RBO
> > > > in there for awhile, but one day you'll wake up and it will be
> > > gone.
> > > > Gone,
> > > > I tell you, GONE! Just you wait. 5, 10 years from now, RBO will
> > > be
> > > > a
> > > > mere
> > > > a memory. Just like Forms2.3. Oh, and that "select * from tab;"
> > > > that
> > > > you're doing every once in awhile to see if it still works, you
> > > just
> > > > wait,
> > > > someday *someday* we're going to take *that* away too. And you're
> > > > just
> > > > going to have to live with it. HAhahahaha!
> > > >
> > > > So, what do you think? Will v5 ever really go away? And when will
> > > > RBO just
> > > > stop working?
> > > >
> > > > Bambi.
> > > > --
> > > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > > > --
> > > > Author: Bellow, Bambi
> > > > INET: bbellow_at_chi.navtech.com
> > > >
> > > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
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> > > subscribing).
> > > >
> > >
> > > Mladen Gogala
> > > Oracle DBA
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Note:
> > > This message is for the named person's use only. It may contain
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> > > notify the
> > > sender. You must not, directly or indirectly, use, disclose,
> > > distribute,
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> > > the
> > > right to monitor all e-mail communications through its networks.
> > > Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual
> > > sender,
> > > except where the message states otherwise and the sender is
> > > authorized
> > > to
> > > state them to be the views of any such entity.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > > --
> > > Author: Mladen Gogala
> > > INET: mladen_at_wangtrading.com
> > >
> > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> > >
> > > --
> > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > > --
> > > Author: Stephane Paquette
> > > INET: stephane.paquette_at_standardlife.ca
> > >
> > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> > > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> > >
> >
> > Mladen Gogala
> > Oracle DBA
> >
> >
> >
> > Note:
> > This message is for the named person's use only. It may contain
> > confidential, proprietary or legally privileged information. No
> > confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by any mistransmission. If
> > you receive this message in error, please immediately delete it and all
> > copies of it from your system, destroy any hard copies of it and notify
> the
> > sender. You must not, directly or indirectly, use, disclose, distribute,
> > print, or copy any part of this message if you are not the intended
> > recipient. Wang Trading LLC and any of its subsidiaries each reserve the
> > right to monitor all e-mail communications through its networks.
> > Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender,
> > except where the message states otherwise and the sender is authorized to
> > state them to be the views of any such entity.
> >
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > --
> > Author: Mladen Gogala
> > INET: mladen_at_wangtrading.com
> >
> > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> >
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > --
> > Author: Stephane Paquette
> > INET: stephane.paquette_at_standardlife.ca
> >
> > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > --
> > Author: Bellow, Bambi
> > INET: bbellow_at_chi.navtech.com
> >
> > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > --
> > Author: Stephane Paquette
> > INET: stephane.paquette_at_standardlife.ca
> >
> > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
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>
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> --
> Author: <rgaffuri_at_cox.net
> INET: rgaffuri_at_cox.net
>
> Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> --
> Author: Bellow, Bambi
> INET: bbellow_at_chi.navtech.com
>
> Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services
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>
--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
--
Author: <rgaffuri_at_cox.net
INET: rgaffuri_at_cox.net
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Received on Mon Oct 20 2003 - 13:14:25 CDT
