Re: RE: oracle or mssql

I meant that the data itself is dirty, i.e. - incorrect at the time of reading.

As for the correct behavior - check ADABAS database. They are allowing what you called dirty reads and they are used in the mainframe all over.

This is a design point in the database that you have to live with. At least, in the ADABAS way you are more correct then incorrect to the tune of 1000's to one.

I just got steamed up because he called it "dirty" reads. To my taste they are uncommitted changes.

Yechiel Adar
Mehish
----- Original Message -----
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com> Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2002 8:42 PM

> It sounds like he is saying that, once an "insert, update or delete"
> statement has been issued (without a following commit), then the records
> acted upon are now considered "dirty" - i.e. needing writing to disk.
>
> this is, of course, NOT what Oracle considers a dirty block.
>
> I agree with you, Jared!
>
> Tom Mercadante
> Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2002 1:21 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> At least one of us has the incorrect understanding of 'dirty' reads,
> or I am taking you too literally, or something.
>
> What are you really saying?
>
> Oracle does not allow dirty reads.
>
> All queries are consistent to a point in time, the beginning
> of a transaction, whether implicit (select) or explicit ( start
> transaction ).
>
> SQL Server and Sybase do not guarantee this.
>
> The 'dirty' reads you are speaking of sound more to me
> like sloppy programming.
>
> Is that what you're referring to?
>
> Jared
>
>
>
>
>
>
> "Yechiel Adar" <adar76_at_inter.net.il>
> Sent by: root_at_fatcity.com
> 10/30/2002 08:54 AM
> Please respond to ORACLE-L
>
>
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
<ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
> cc:
> Subject: Re: RE: oracle or mssql
>
>
> I would like to point out that what you call "dirty reads" are mostly
> the correct reads. Oracle method IS the dirty read.
>
> I am sure that your users does at least 1000 commits to every rollback.
> So when oracle gives you the data it already knows that this data is
> wrong. If you do the query again a minute later you will get new results
> that were available when you did the original query but were committed
> later. So you get a 1000/1 chance to get incorrect data.
>
> The "dirty read" method, on the other hand, gives you the current values,
> believing that they will be committed in a moment. So you get 1/1000
> chance
> to get wrong data.
>
> Which odds will you bet on?
>
> Yechiel Adar
> Mehish
> ----- Original Message -----
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2002 2:18 PM
>
>
> List,
> I'm always keen to refresh on database comparisons so thanks for
> everyone's pointers.
>
> I'm surprised Oracle doesn't make more of an issue about their locking and
> concurrency methods (i.e. redo/rollback/undo).
>
> MSSQL seems to deal with it in two ways:
> Default: readers and writers prevent writers from accessing data until
> they
> are finished with it!
> Other method: no control, you just get dirty reads!
>
> Anyone got anything to add to this? Or am I wrong?
>
> - Mike.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Sent: 24 October 2002 17:29
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> As I said, use mssql ONLY if your boss is willing to be strapped into a
> MicroSlop only platform. If he's even remotely thinking of using a
> different OS
> then you can't use mssql.
>
> Dick Goulet
>
> ____________________Reply Separator____________________
> Author: GKor_at_rdw.nl
> Date: 10/23/2002 11:48 PM
>
> goodmorning
> everybody who responded to my basic question : thanks
>
> summary
>
> professional : use oracle enterprise edition
> semi professional : use oracle standard edition / mssql enterprise edition
> in all other cases mssql standard edition
>
>
>
> > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> > Van: Mohammad Rafiq [SMTP:rafiq9857_at_hotmail.com]
> > Verzonden: woensdag 23 oktober 2002 20:51
> > Aan: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Onderwerp: RE: oracle or mssql
> >
> > Xenix is history now...SCO itself stopped it sometime in 1990
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Reply-To: ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
> > Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 09:02:19 -0800
> >
> > XENIX maybe.
> >
> > : )
> >
> > Regards,
> > Patrice Boivin
> > Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
> >
> > Systems Admin & Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
> > Technology Services | Services technologiques
> > Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
> > Maritimes Region, DFO | Région des Maritimes, MPO
> >
> > E-Mail: boivinp_at_mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2002 12:59 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > Is MSSQL server available on UNIX?
> >
> > -Rachna
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Boivin, Patrice J
> > INET: BoivinP_at_mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca
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Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Yechiel Adar
  INET: adar76_at_inter.net.il

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