> additional tests to
> convert it OCP7, took the two upgrades for 8 and 8i
> respectively. I
> never studied for the tests, in fact, I took them on
> the spur of the
> moment each time. I had never worked with 8 or 8i
> when I took those
> upgrades. so what does that tell you?
tells me that you are either twice lucky or the
goddess that people call you .. lol
have a good one you all and peace please :)
Deepak
PS: boy .. i must be really dumb .. cuz i sure had to
read the jason couchman guide to get thru the 8i ocp
..btw his 9i upgrade exam guide is due on Jan 15th ..
and you guessed right .. i will be in the line at
borders or someplace to grab my copy:)
- Rachel Carmichael <wisernet100_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
> John,
>
> the thing that scares me about OCP is not that the
> technical interviews
> won't catch people who don't know anything. If I
> can't tech someone and
> find out that they just know what they studied for
> OCP, I shouldn't be
> doing tech interviews.
>
> What I find disturbing is when the HR department
> makes the rule that
> unless a candidate has OCP on their resume, you
> can't hire them. It's
> the people who don't understand what is behind those
> initials who then
> make rules based on them that are worrisome.
>
> As an example, I have a FANTASTIC associate DBA.
> He's smart, quick to
> learn, motivated to learn on his own, curious and
> willing to ask for
> help. He doesn't have OCP. He doesn't have a college
> degree (he's
> ex-military and got his computer training there).
>
> If HR had had a policy that I could only hire
> someone with a college
> degree or someone with OCP, I would have lost one of
> the best
> assistants I've ever had.
>
> I have OCP through 8i. I took chauncey, took the
> additional tests to
> convert it OCP7, took the two upgrades for 8 and 8i
> respectively. I
> never studied for the tests, in fact, I took them on
> the spur of the
> moment each time. I had never worked with 8 or 8i
> when I took those
> upgrades. so what does that tell you? That I take
> standardized tests
> well, and can eliminate enough choices to be able to
> guess the correct
> answer more often than not. That pretty much
> qualifies me for "Do You
> Want to Be a Millionaire" but not for Oracle work.
>
> Do I list the OCP on my resume? Yes, because I am
> smart enough to know
> that it will open some doors. It's at the very end
> of a 4 page resume,
> so I don't know how often it actually gets seen.
> And that's my
> intention.
>
> I am very anxious to see just what the practicum
> test involves. I do
> wish you didn't have to take additional classes
> before you could
> qualify for it, but I understand that Oracle does
> try to make a profit.
> I'd like to see them accept an "equivalent" exam
> from somewhere else as
> well. If they are going to mimic what the colleges
> do for higher
> degrees they should do it properly.
>
> Rachel
> --- orantdba <orantdba_at_netscape.net> wrote:
> > Hi Rachel,
> >
> > Now we are to the point, is it valuable? I say
> yes and I have
> > studied
> > for and
> > passed the ocp for 7, upgraded to 8 and to 8i and
> will soon take the
> > 9i
> > upgrade
> > test. I also hold the Oracle 7 certification that
> was offered by
> > Chauncey before
> > the Oracle came out with the OCP. Others say it
> is not. It is their
> >
> > dollar, and
> > they can spend it as they wish.
> >
> > Ultimately the market decides value, I don't
> believe that any sane
> > manager of DBA's
> > would hire someone just because they are ocp's.
> Managers would tend
> > to
> > value
> > relevant experience, the interview process, and
> degrees well before
> > looking at ocp's.
> >
> > So why do I think it is important? The first
> person who sees your
> > resume is usually
> > in the HR department. They cannot hire you but
> they can file your
> > resume in the
> > circular file. Cute little designations like OCA,
> OCP, OCM, MCP,
> > MCSE,
> > CNE, etc
> > help get you past those people and on to the
> people who can actually
> > understand you
> > when you talke about performing block dumps and
> interrogating the
> > itl.
> > Those people
> > can say yes and will because of my experience and
> interview presence.
> >
> > They will
> > probably not care one bit about the cute little
> designations, but it
> > is
> > irrevelant if I don't
> > get to talk to them.
> >
> > I have had the discussion at oow, etc with more
> than a few people
> > (perhaps even you)
> > asking if you had two candidates with exactly the
> same criterias but
> > one
> > had OCP and
> > one didn't which would you hire? This is a little
> like the "If god
> > is
> > all powerful can he make
> > a rock so big that he himself cannot pick it up"
> question. In the
> > case
> > described above I would
> > probably go to things like "Which is cheaper?",
> "Which had
> > experience
> > that most matched my
> > project?", " Which had the best personality match
> for my group?". I
> >
> > don't think OCP would
> > make that much of a difference.
> >
> > John
> >
> > wisernet100_at_yahoo.com wrote:
> >
> > >John,
> > >
> > >I have no objection to Oracle trying to make
> money (heck, I own
> > stock,
> > >I WANT and expect them to make money!)
> > >
> > >The problem is not that they are trying to make
> money, but that this
> > is
> > >becoming something you HAVE to do/have to get a
> job working with
> > >Oracle. And they haven't convinced me of the
> value of that piece of
> > >paper. I know way too many certified DBAs who I
> wouldn't trust to
> > even
> > >query my databases.
> > >
> > >Rachel
> > >
> > >--- orantdba <orantdba_at_netscape.net> wrote:
> > >
> > >>Hmmm,
> > >>
> > >>Imagine that, a publicly traded company that it
> trying to make
> > >>money, I
> > >>am shocked
> > >>dismayed, I don't believe I will be able to
> sleep tonight.
> > >>
> > >>Chris, could you provide me with the list of
> companies that are
> > not
> > >>trying to make money?
> > >>I want to make sure that I don't go to work for
> them, or learn
> > their
> > >>products.
> > >>
> > >>John :-)
> > >>
> > >>Chris.Bowes_at_kosa.com wrote:
> > >>
> > >>>I'd say the cost is being raised. Look at the
> requirements for
> > >>>
> > >>each.
> > >>
> > >>>You can't just take the OCM exam. No we would
> first have to get
> > >>>
> > >>the
> > >>
> > >>>OCA. Whether or not we need the entry level
> cert we have to have
> > >>>
> > >>it.
> > >>
> > >>>Then, and only then, can we take the OCP. Then
> and only then, can
> > >>>
> > >>we
> > >>
> > >>>take the OCM and that is after we take these
> REQUIRED classes from
> >
> > >>>Oracle Ed. So someone the caliber of Steve
> Adams or Jared Still,
> > >>>
> > >>has
> > >>
> > >>>to spend money in a class that they could
> probably teach from
> > >>>
> > >>memory
> > >>
> > >>>before they can get certification and that is
> after getting 2
> > other
> > >>>
> > >>>certs that have no value to them. Call me a
> cynic, but to me,
> > this
> > >>>
> > >>is
> > >>
> > >>>nothing but a money grab.
> > >>>
> > >>>From the website:
> > >>>
> > >>>--To become an Oracle Associate, you must pass
> the exams required
> > >>>-- for the Oracle Associate level of your
> selected job role.
> > >>>
> > >>Typically,
> > >>
> > >>>--two exams are required; the first one can be
> taken via the
> > >>>
> > >>Internet,
> > >>
> > >>>--while subsequent exams must be taken in a
> proctored environment.
> > >>>
> > >>By
> > >>
> > >>>--completing your Oracle Associate, you are
> half-way toward
> > >>>
> > >>achieving the
> > >>
> > >>>-- Oracle Certified Professional credential.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>--To become an Oracle Certified Professional,
> you must pass all
> > >>>required exams
> > >>>--in your selected job role, including those at
> the Associate
> > >>>
> > >>level.
> > >>
> > >>>
> > >>>--To become an Oracle Certified Master, you
> must first be an
> > Oracle
> > >>>--Certified Professional. Additionally,
> achieving your OCM
> > >>>
> > >>credential
> > >>
> > >>>--requires attending two advanced level Oracle
> University courses
> > >>>
> > >>from
> > >>
> > >>>--the list shown on this page as well as
> passing the OCM Practicum
> > >>>
> > >>exam.
> > >>
> > >>>
> > >>>--Chris
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>-----Original Message-----
> > >>>From: dgoulet_at_vicr.com [
> mailto:dgoulet_at_vicr.com ]
> > >>>Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 9:16 AM
> > >>>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > >>>Subject: The OCP bar is being raised
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>Anyone care to comment on the following, IMHO
> it's about time:
> > >>>
> >
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >>>---
> > >>>Introducing two new levels of Oracle Certified
> Professional (OCP)
> > >>>Achievement
> > >>>
> > >>>A recent *IDC report on IT Education and
> Training Services quoted
> >
> === message truncated ===
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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> Author: Rachel Carmichael
> INET: wisernet100_at_yahoo.com
>
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Received on Sun Jan 13 2002 - 19:16:02 CST
