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Home -> Community -> Mailing Lists -> Oracle-L -> RE: Griping about auditing (not the Oracle Kind)
My
point precisely. I'm not putting my neck on the line because someone won't allow
me to do my job. Let them be the one who takes the hit when the s**t hits the
fan.
<SPAN
class=437432007-26062001>
Thanks
Chris, good point well made (better than my knee jerk reaction to Kimberleys
mail anyways !!
<SPAN
class=437432007-26062001>
<SPAN
class=437432007-26062001>Cheers
<SPAN
class=437432007-26062001>
<SPAN
class=437432007-26062001>Lee
<FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----From: Bowes, Chris
[mailto:Chris.Bowes_at_kosa.com]Sent: 25 June 2001 22:06To:
Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: Griping about
auditing (not the Oracle Kind)
In a perfect world or even a sucky world, yes. But the
nightmare scenerio that was laid out wouldn't allow proactivity on their part.
The inconvenient time thing was due to the fact that the proactive items they
wanted to to do were rejected. They had a table that was diagnosed with
too small extents and they wanted a bigger extent size. They submitted
paperwork and a non-tech management type said 'no'. Does he disobey the
rules and risk getting fired? They made other requests for day-to-day
events and possible problems. They were rejected because "you cannot do
that many changes". Do they risk their jobs and do what is needed,
knowing eventually someone *WILL* find out and at that point they can/will be
terminated for insubordination and failure to follow process or at least
slapped down big for it?
In all situations I had seen until here, I would say, yes,
proactivity is a must and I know that we can look at any one item and get
around rules that get our way. When it becomes a corporate culture, you
really need to get the policy eliminated. The way to do that is to allow
the people who can make these stupid decisions suffer. He simply said
"OK, if that's the way you want to play it, then I'll do what you say. I
will follow your rules and not fix things I see wrong because *you say I
can't*. Of course, you wouldn't know a database problem if it jumped up
and bit you and said, 'Hi I am a database problem', but that's
irrelevant. I will do it your way and fix it when it breaks and
you're franticly signing off on the same paperwork you rejected x days/months
ago. Just don't expect a friendly call at 2 am when it
happens..."
I agree, we need to be proactive,
however, the way I read this issue, they were proactive and lots of times when
they made suggestions, they were rejected and their proactivity was rendered
moot by people who have no clue. When that happens, it is wise to make
them feel some pain for the decisions they make.
--Chris Chris.Bowes_at_Kosa.com
-----Original Message----- From:
Jared.Still_at_radisys.com [<A
href="mailto:Jared.Still_at_radisys.com">mailto:Jared.Still_at_radisys.com]
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 4:01 PM <FONT
size=2>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <FONT
size=2>Subject: RE: Griping about auditing (not the Oracle Kind)
Kimberly,
We're on the same wavelength, as I was thinking the same
thing.
Procrastinating on something that you know needs to be
done is not an ethical way of dealing with this,
IMO.
Jared
<FONT
size=2>
size=2>
Smith
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size=2> jitsu.com> cc:
size=2>
by: Subject: RE: Griping about auditing (not the OracleKind) <FONT
size=2> root_at_fatcity.com
size=2>
size=2>
size=2>
AM
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to
size=2> ORACLE-L
size=2>
size=2>
I say that if you wait until you database has an error you
really aren't proving much except that you are not
proactive in your job. Which, in my book, makes you
not a very good DBA. Dealing with a dumb process
is one thing (we have our fair share on this account) <FONT
size=2>but I take to much pride in my work to let things fail because I
need to fill in a piece of paper.
-----Original Message----- Sent:
Monday, June 25, 2001 9:43 AM To: Multiple recipients
of list ORACLE-L
Wahey !!! The answer I was going to provide. We started
calling the manager up quite frequently at home to
authorise changes - he eventually saw sense. Not quite
as bad as 2am in the morning but inconvenient enough for him to
put a stop to it.
Best of Luck.
-----Original Message----- Sent: 25
June 2001 17:07 To: Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L
Jay; I have had to go thru the
same thing a couple times on a previous job <FONT
size=2>with Auditors. Every time those kind of
restrictions were placed on us it brought things to a
snails pace or, in some conditions, a complete halt. <FONT
size=2>Sooner or later they realized that it was unreasonable and lifted
them. But it was a pain until
they did it.
It took them a while to realize that we HAD to work the way we
did in order to keep things running smoothly.
I personally think that you should wait with resizing any of
your production data files
until you get oracle errors saying that things can not extend.
At that time, call up the Sr. VP at 2 am in the morning and
tell him that you have a crisis but you can not
proceed until you get his permission because of the
restrictions placed on you by the Auditors. Repeat this
process as many times as neccessary for them to lift the
restrictions.
Kevin
-----Original Message----- Sent:
Monday, June 25, 2001 9:32 AM To: Multiple recipients
of list ORACLE-L
We've been through an internal audit and I was just wondering
if anyone else has to deal
with the rather ludicrous requirements I now have. In order to
add or resize a datafile I now need to fill out a form and
get Senior VP approval and the alert logs must be
reviewed every day by a non-DBA in order
to be certain that I didn't make any database changes without
such approval. The auditors
were horrified to discover that not only did I do such things <FONT
size=2>whenever I thought them necessary but that we didn't have a non-DBA
review everything I did after an Oracle upgrade to
ensure I didn't install any other software.
Fortunately I managed to convince them that yes, I really did
need a Unix login (they were skeptical).
So, any similar horror stories?
Jay Miller Sr. Oracle DBA
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