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Home -> Community -> Mailing Lists -> Oracle-L -> RE: Griping about auditing (not the Oracle Kind)
In a perfect world or even a sucky world, yes. But the nightmare scenerio that was laid out wouldn't allow proactivity on their part. The inconvenient time thing was due to the fact that the proactive items they wanted to to do were rejected. They had a table that was diagnosed with too small extents and they wanted a bigger extent size. They submitted paperwork and a non-tech management type said 'no'. Does he disobey the rules and risk getting fired? They made other requests for day-to-day events and possible problems. They were rejected because "you cannot do that many changes". Do they risk their jobs and do what is needed, knowing eventually someone *WILL* find out and at that point they can/will be terminated for insubordination and failure to follow process or at least slapped down big for it?
In all situations I had seen until here, I would say, yes, proactivity is a must and I know that we can look at any one item and get around rules that get our way. When it becomes a corporate culture, you really need to get the policy eliminated. The way to do that is to allow the people who can make these stupid decisions suffer. He simply said "OK, if that's the way you want to play it, then I'll do what you say. I will follow your rules and not fix things I see wrong because *you say I can't*. Of course, you wouldn't know a database problem if it jumped up and bit you and said, 'Hi I am a database problem', but that's irrelevant. I will do it your way and fix it when it breaks and you're franticly signing off on the same paperwork you rejected x days/months ago. Just don't expect a friendly call at 2 am when it happens..."
I agree, we need to be proactive, however, the way I read this issue, they were proactive and lots of times when they made suggestions, they were rejected and their proactivity was rendered moot by people who have no clue. When that happens, it is wise to make them feel some pain for the decisions they make.
--Chris
Chris.Bowes_at_Kosa.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Jared.Still_at_radisys.com [mailto:Jared.Still_at_radisys.com]
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 4:01 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: Griping about auditing (not the Oracle Kind)
Kimberly,
We're on the same wavelength, as I was thinking the same thing.
Procrastinating on something that you know needs to be done is not an ethical way of dealing with this, IMO.
Jared
Kimberly Smith <kimberly.smith_at_gmd.fu To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com> jitsu.com> cc: Sent by: Subject: RE: Griping about auditing (not the Oracle Kind) root_at_fatcity.com 06/25/01 10:15 AM Please respond to ORACLE-L
I say that if you wait until you database has an error you really aren't proving much except that you are not proactive in your job. Which, in my book, makes you not a very good DBA. Dealing with a dumb process is one thing (we have our fair share on this account) but I take to much pride in my work to let things fail because I need to fill in a piece of paper.
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 9:43 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Wahey !!! The answer I was going to provide. We started calling the manager up quite frequently at home to authorise changes - he eventually saw sense. Not quite as bad as 2am in the morning but inconvenient enough for him to put a stop to it.
Best of Luck.
-----Original Message-----
Sent: 25 June 2001 17:07
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Jay;
I have had to go thru the same thing a couple times on a previous job
with
Auditors. Every time those kind of restrictions were placed on us it
brought things to a snails pace or, in some conditions, a complete halt.
Sooner or later they realized that it was unreasonable and lifted them.
But
it was a pain until they did it.
It took them a while to realize that we HAD to work the way we did in order to keep things running smoothly.
I personally think that you should wait with resizing any of your
production
data files until you get oracle errors saying that things can not extend.
At that time, call up the Sr. VP at 2 am in the morning and tell him that
you have a crisis but you can not proceed until you get his permission
because of the restrictions placed on you by the Auditors. Repeat this
process as many times as neccessary for them to lift the restrictions.
Kevin
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 9:32 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
We've been through an internal audit and I was just wondering if anyone
else
has to deal with the rather ludicrous requirements I now have. In order to
add or resize a datafile I now need to fill out a form and get Senior VP
approval and the alert logs must be reviewed every day by a non-DBA in
order
to be certain that I didn't make any database changes without such
approval.
The auditors were horrified to discover that not only did I do such things
whenever I thought them necessary but that we didn't have a non-DBA review
everything I did after an Oracle upgrade to ensure I didn't install any
other software.
Fortunately I managed to convince them that yes, I really did need a Unix
login (they were skeptical).
So, any similar horror stories?
Jay Miller
Sr. Oracle DBA
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Author: Miller, Jay
INET: JayMiller_at_TDWaterhouse.com
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