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Home -> Community -> Mailing Lists -> Oracle-L -> RE: Oracle-L archives: classics / (Fwd): Re: Here we go again...
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HA HA!
Fast Forward: [deleted] here passed all exams in a breeze and believes that OCP = Buzzword.
Gotta admit I laughed at my own comment and g's ever so clever analogy. However after experiencing the job market frenzy I'm sure I would have landed the job I have, same $$$, without OCP. It was one question in the first of three interviews to work here - no other company asked about OCP, or college for that matter. However they put me through a very grueling tech interview.
I believe 'it's what you know'.
Lisa [deleted] Koivu
The *O*verly *C*areful and *P*recautionary DBA (usually)
Now gainfully employed in Florida and learning some pretty cool stuff.
-----Original Message-----
From: Eric D. Pierce [mailto:PierceED_at_csus.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2000 2:56 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Oracle-L archives: classics / (Fwd): Re: Here we go again...OCP
Since this was under discussion again recently (fyi):
Date sent: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 06:34:56 -0800 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
[deleted] wrote:
> I am wondering now about what OCP is really good for then. I do not have
a
> bachelor's degree so I want to complete OCP anyway. It will make job
hunting in
> Florida with less than one year experience as a DBA a bit easier. Does
anyone
> else feel that this certification is worthless?
Well, let me tell you a story. Way, way back when, there was a file/print server called NetWarez. (Names changes to protect the innocent). Now, NetWarez wasn't terribly difficult to use, and it did only two things (filin' and printin') but it did them rather well. One day, Corporate America (tm) woke up and said to itself, "hmm, gotta get me some of that". So, pretty soon, NetWarez is installed everywhere, and everyone's relying on it. Lots of people suddenly decide they want to be NetWarez administrators, because these are relied on and well rewarded within the corporate environment. Soon, the situation gets out of hand: people who've barely any experience are passing themselves off as NetWarez gurus, and the only time their employers find out is when Something Goes Wrong.
So the Navel Corporation, vendors of NetWarez, create a certification programme, to ensure that NetWarez admins have a certain baseline of skill. This programme was aggressively marketed, and within not very much time at all, no-one will hire anyone who doesn't have the certificate - in fact, they won't even bother to interview them. It is practically impossible to get a NetWarez job today without a CNE.
Roll forward a few years, and Navel's arch-rival M1<r0$oF+ roll out their own certification programme, Must Consult Someone Experienced. They too aggressively promote certification, and industry is in the process now of employers making it a prerequisite for an interview. No-one takes it particularly seriously (at least, I hope not) but in this age of high staff turnover and long hours, anything that cuts down the shortlist quickly is welcomed. And more and more, a M1<r0$oF+ certificate is asked for in job adverts. Other corporations, such as Sin Microsystems, are now pushing their own certificates, and so are 'Orrible.
So, anyway, I'm both an OCP and an MCSE. Both were easy, and I passed 'em over lunch breaks. They add buzzwords to the CV, and these days, that's sometimes called for. I don't expect either of them to actually influence an interviewer, but I do expect them to make me stand out on a shortlist this year, and get me on the shortlist in the first place next year.
So, from that perspective, if you can get a certificate without too spending too much of your own time and money on it, then you might as well. And, for the reasons above, it's not worthless.
Cheers,
g
-- guy ruth hammond <grh_at_agency.com> | "Wade in with our workboots, Technology / Synergy / Consulting | try to finish the job." 07879607148 http://www.agency.com | -- Dar Williams -- Author: guy ruth hammond INET: grh_at_agency.com ------- End of forwarded message ------- -- Author: Eric D. Pierce INET: PierceED_at_csus.edu Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). ------_=_NextPart_001_01BFF670.F109D82C Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> <HTML> <HEAD> <META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1"> <META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version = 5.5.2650.12"> <TITLE>RE: Oracle-L archives: classics / (Fwd): Re: Here we go = again...OCP</TITLE> </HEAD> <BODY> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>HA HA!</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Fast Forward: [deleted] here passed all = exams in a breeze and believes that OCP =3D Buzzword. </FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Gotta admit I laughed at my own comment and g's ever = so clever analogy. However after experiencing the job market = frenzy I'm sure I would have landed the job I have, same $$$, without = OCP. It was one question in the first of three interviews to work = here - no other company asked about OCP, or college for that = matter. However they put me through a very grueling tech = interview. </FONT></P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>I believe 'it's what you know'. </FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Lisa [deleted] Koivu</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>The *O*verly *C*areful and *P*recautionary DBA = (usually)</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Now gainfully employed in Florida and learning some = pretty cool stuff.</FONT> </P> <BR> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>-----Original Message-----</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>From: Eric D. Pierce [<A = HREF=3D"mailto:PierceED_at_csus.edu">mailto:PierceED_at_csus.edu</A>]</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2000 2:56 PM</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Subject: Oracle-L archives: classics / (Fwd): Re: = Here we go again...OCP</FONT> </P> <BR> <BR> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Since this was under discussion again recently = (fyi):</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>------- Forwarded Message Follows -------</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Date sent: Fri, 28 Apr = 2000 06:34:56 -0800</FONT> <BR><FONT = SIZE=3D2>To: = Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L = <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com></FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>[deleted] wrote:</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>> I am wondering now about what OCP is really good = for then. I do not have a</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> bachelor's degree so I want to complete OCP = anyway. It will make job hunting in</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Florida with less than one year experience as a = DBA a bit easier. Does anyone</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> else feel that this certification is = worthless?</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Well, let me tell you a story. Way, way back when, = there was a file/print</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>server called NetWarez. (Names changes to protect = the innocent). Now, </FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>NetWarez wasn't terribly difficult to use, and it = did only two things</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>(filin' and printin') but it did them rather well. = One day, Corporate</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>America (tm) woke up and said to itself, "hmm, = gotta get me some of that".</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>So, pretty soon, NetWarez is installed everywhere, = and everyone's</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>relying on it. Lots of people suddenly decide they = want to be NetWarez</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>administrators, because these are relied on and well = rewarded within the</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>corporate environment. Soon, the situation gets out = of hand: people who've</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>barely any experience are passing themselves off as = NetWarez gurus, and</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>the only time their employers find out is when = Something Goes Wrong.</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>So the Navel Corporation, vendors of NetWarez, create = a certification</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>programme, to ensure that NetWarez admins have a = certain baseline of skill.</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>This programme was aggressively marketed, and within = not very much time at</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>all, no-one will hire anyone who doesn't have the = certificate - in fact,</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>they won't even bother to interview them. It is = practically impossible</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>to get a NetWarez job today without a CNE.</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Roll forward a few years, and Navel's arch-rival = M1<r0$oF+ roll out their</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>own certification programme, Must Consult Someone = Experienced. They too</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>aggressively promote certification, and industry is = in the process now of </FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>employers making it a prerequisite for an interview. = No-one takes it</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>particularly seriously (at least, I hope not) but in = this age of high staff</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>turnover and long hours, anything that cuts down the = shortlist quickly</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>is welcomed. And more and more, a M1<r0$oF+ = certificate is asked for in </FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>job adverts. Other corporations, such as Sin = Microsystems, are now pushing </FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>their own certificates, and so are 'Orrible.</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>So, anyway, I'm both an OCP and an MCSE. Both were = easy, and I passed 'em</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>over lunch breaks. They add buzzwords to the CV, and = these days, that's</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>sometimes called for. I don't expect either of them = to actually influence</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>an interviewer, but I do expect them to make me = stand out on a shortlist</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>this year, and get me on the shortlist in the first = place next year.</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>So, from that perspective, if you can get a = certificate without too spending</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>too much of your own time and money on it, then you = might as well. And, for</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>the reasons above, it's not worthless.</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Cheers,</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>g</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>-- </FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>guy ruth hammond <grh_at_agency.com> | "Wade = in with our workboots,</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Technology / Synergy / Consulting = | try to finish the job."</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>07879607148 <A HREF=3D"http://www.agency.com" = TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.agency.com</A> = | -- Dar Williams</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>-- </FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Author: guy ruth hammond</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> INET: grh_at_agency.com</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>------- End of forwarded message -------</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>-- </FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Author: Eric D. Pierce</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> INET: PierceED_at_csus.edu</FONT> </P> <P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Fat City Network Services -- (858) = 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>San Diego, = California -- Public Internet = access / Mailing Lists</FONT> <BR><FONT = SIZE=3D2>---------------------------------------------------------------= -----</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an = E-Mail message</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of = 'ListGuru') and in</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB =Received on Tue Jul 25 2000 - 14:45:43 CDT
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